Transcript of inaugural Scrapple

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Transcript of inaugural Scrapple

Postby BossHog » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:53 pm

Scrapple 1
The official, unabridged transcript


I have changed my mind on the voting due to length of time.... I will post a poll for the winner tomorrow.

Question 1:

Why is keeping Champ good for the Redskins franchise?

DEHog:
Come on this isn't a question he is a top 5 Cb he's put up numbers with 5 different DC not pass rush. Has been a model player lived up to his rookie contract, no holdouts.4 Pro Bowls, 3 All Pro selections andhas never missed a game!!! This isn't about why we should keep him it's about how we can afford to keep him

skinsfaninroanoke:
While keeping Champ may be good for the franchise because he is one of the best cover corners, his skills have noticeably deteriorated in the last two years. His interceptions and passes defended have declined while he is expecting his salary to appreciate. While he is good, with his being burned by Conway, Toomer and the likes, can we afford to keep him at the expense of sacrificing other players? Understandably, he has been known as a shut down corner, but if possession receivers like those can burn him down the sidelines, how much longer is it until more people are taking it to him and burning him?

DEHog:
His number decline because you can only compare him to Champ himself and he still made PB and AP All pro 2nd team . It was Booker not Conway. As for Toomer this is what you said on Monday after the Giants game, "While Champ did get burned a few times, most of the passing to receivers came against Smoot, who played like he had a concussion"

Question 2:

What is the biggest advantage to Champ bailey NOT being a Redskin next year?

skinsfaninroanoke:
The biggest advantage I can see is the salary cap space that won't be occupied by Champ thus hamstringing the Redskins. The second part to that same advantage is in trading Champ once he is tagged, the Redskins can gain compensation to fill other holes in the team.

DEHog:
If we tag Champ history say no one will take him...loke at MCAllister last year. If Det wanted a CB so bad why not him inseat they got Dre Bly FA.. So the Skins will be staddled with paying Champ to average of the top 5 or around 6 mil. We are better off inking him to a long term cap friendly deal! ala Arrington

skinsfaninroanoke:
Arrington's deal is effective until 2007 when his cap number hits 9 mil a year and 11 the next. The cap numbers don't stay even, the contracts escalate. Champ's won't stay at 6 - it'll rise fast.

Snapper 1: Is Champ worth the salary cap hit? Why or why not?

DE Hog: No not as franchise tag too high but a more friendly long term will help get fa players

Snapper 2: The franchise tag carries a guaranteed top 5 CB salary for Champ but that wasn't enough, is he a top 3 CB?

DE Hog: Yes with Ty law Macallister he 3rd at kleast

Snapper 3: Champ is going to sign for money that puts him as the second or third highest paid player on the team... what non football characteristic (intangible) suggests that he is or isn't worthy of this elite status.

skinsfaninroanoke: his attitude

Feedback question 1:

Would the Redskins be better suited with a shutdown corner like Champ and an average pass ruhing DE, or a lesser corner back and a quality defensive end?

DE Hog:
Great question since you said average I'll say we're better off with shutdown corner...if only Champ had had a average pass rush the last 5 years!!!!

Feedback question 2:
Is bringing Champ back worth the money that could be used to fill multiple spots with that money?

skinsfaninroanoke:
No - we have to stop the run and pass rush. We can't do that without rebuilding the line and that will be expensive. Better line - less time for an avg. cb to cover
Last edited by BossHog on Wed Jan 21, 2004 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sean Taylor was one of a kind, may he rest in peace.

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Postby DEHog » Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:20 pm

Ok I have bit my lip all week. I'm going to get this out and that will be the end of it for me.

Great job tonight SfansR

Some points to make about the Champ saga

ROI-Return or risk on investment...we have watched many a reskins walk out the door some willingly and some not. Champ is not a risk he has played in every game and never held out I have watched many here condemn him for his attitude, and in the same breathe talk about bringing in players like Staley, (holdout) Dillion (attitude) Green (everything)and Kearse (injury).


Yes a passrush would be nice so would a shut down corner..why can't we have both. Tell me who is going to come in here and get a pass rush all the time...there are many great O-Line in the league. When does coaching enter into this. Tell me the names of the guys on the NE D-Line, they got pressure on Manning and they have a shutdown corner in Law..why can't we.Maybe it's about schemes ???

The other knock on Champ is additude...take off your fan glasses and put on your employee glasses. You are one of the top five employees in your career field. there are only 63 other guys who do what you do. For the last 5 years you have preform in the top 10 (5 in my judgemant) but 23 other are compensated more then you...your contract is up for renewal, what are you going to do?? How will you act. Remember this is their job!!

Leadership, There are many different leadership styles, I think Champ leads by example. Smoot said the Skins don't win a SB without him....that may not be true but that's how a teammate feels about him. Don't forget we had a SD corner in DG during those SB years!!

There are 3 options here
Release him and and gain the cap space (good for the Skins)
Tag him and pay him b/c I don't see anyone giving up the picks. Players like this more then you think (good for Champ)
Long term cap friendly deal, leaving enough for some D-Line help (good for everyone)

The one thing that has change since this topic started is Joe Gibbs is now HC...I trust his albilty to work through this with Champ and his judgement in this case .

I think everybody here believes I want Champ here next year, me personally yes I would. My argument is not about if we should keep him or not. My argument is that a football player has a right to be paid comeserate to his performance on the field. I will live with whatever the Skins decide allways have.
There you have it I'm done!!! :lol:
Last edited by DEHog on Tue Jan 20, 2004 6:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Sean Taylor is hands down the best athlete I've ever coached it's not even close" Gregg Williams 2005 Mini-Camp

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Postby skinsfaninroanoke » Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:33 pm

simply put - we have 9 mil in cap space. Period. We don't have any more than that without cutting some people. Champ doesn't have anything to give to that - his contract is up and his numbers don't count anymore in the payroll - he can just take from it - whatever we pay out will come from the free cap space. If he takes 6 mil + a year.. and it WILL escalate - the contracts all do now... it won't be long before we HAVE to cut him or someone else without compensation because no one will want to pay 10-11 million for anyone if they can help it. He won't even be trade fodder then.

There is no such thing as a long term cap friendly deal - if he goes for 6 now, it will be 7-8 next year - 8-9 the next...

If we spend 6 on him this year, we can count on the fact that as things stand right now we will have 3 mil to pay for our draft picks - most of that going to the #5 pick in the draft. We will have almost no room for FA at all. There is no getting around that part of it.

Is he top 5? Not in most of the stats that CB are judged under. Not in interceptions, not in passes defended and he may be top 10 in tackles.

His leadership was silent when we needed him the most - Smoot provided so much more in his quotes that sounded like the Burgundy and Gold filled his heart.

We have had average corner backs and great lines and won Super Bowls - three of them. We had Darrell, but we also had guys the likes of Barry Wilburn at the same time. When we had Mann and Manley, Butz and Grant though - we won. Period. In the last 11 years we haven't had a core defensive line and we have lost. A lot. With some of the offensive lines we face every year - Dallas, Philly and NYG... we can't afford not to address that need now.

His attitude this year, I believe, reflected in his play on the field as well as his comments like dictating who we should keep as DC or how it is his time to get paid.

As a salesman, I have been at the top of the company I work for - but I get paid commission on top of a small salary meaning that I get paid for what I accomplish. I don't get paid because my customers like me and take me to dinner... similar to the popularity contest that the lemmings (the media - the same guys keeping Monk from the HOF) run every year in Pro Bowl balloting.

I just don't believe that we can afford his melancholy attitude and less than stellar play on the field at this time. It will cost us too much in the long run.

I had a good time tonight - enjoyed it DEHog. I think it went well for the first one :) Good luck to ya :)
Rich in Roanoke
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