What Happened???

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Re: What Happened???

Postby Chris Luva Luva » Fri Nov 08, 2013 2:01 pm

I can blame both the offense and the defense and that's exactly what I'm going to do.

The offense scored 3 points in the second half, that's not going to cut it.
The defense couldn't stop a runaway tricycle.

I don't take issue with blaming either side, it's the lopsided nature of the criticisms that make my skin crawl. Just like when people blame Kyle for not running the ball but RGIII misses an open receiver. Let's paint and discuss the picture in it's entirety.
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Re: What Happened???

Postby oneman56 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 2:40 pm

Chris Luva Luva wrote:I can blame both the offense and the defense and that's exactly what I'm going to do.

The offense scored 3 points in the second half, that's not going to cut it.
The defense couldn't stop a runaway tricycle.

I don't take issue with blaming either side, it's the lopsided nature of the criticisms that make my skin crawl. Just like when people blame Kyle for not running the ball but RGIII misses an open receiver. Let's paint and discuss the picture in it's entirety.



I can't agree with this. Yes, the offense only scored 3 points and yes they could've done better. Regardless, this loss is on the defense! They let a 13 point lead evaporate, didn't force a single punt and had zero QB sacks in the 2nd half against a team with back-up 0-linemen, a back-up TE and poor QB/back-up QB tandem. As someone else stated Ponder's rating was 30 points higher than any other game this year, explain that? You win as a team and lose as a team, I get that but the offense has bailed the defense out, as recently as the Bears and the Chargers game. At some point, the D has to do the same and it's incapable of it. Good teams have balance and we have none but our offense is way ahead of our defense. We're one of the best rushing teams in the league and our PPG is adequate, it's the defense that for years now has been behind the offense. You cannot expect the offense to score on every drive and you have to be balanced, the offense did enough to win the game last night and the defense did not! I'll agree to disagree with you and storminmormin on this one. I blame the defense and haslett for last nights loss followed by questionable calls (to put it nicely). The offense is the last place i'll put blame.

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Re: What Happened???

Postby EA7649 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 5:12 pm

DaSkinz Baby wrote:
EA7649 wrote:Few things I want to add other than being inconsistent, which has to be solved than we can be a contender. We will have more cap space next year, hopefully the defensive players will improve and we can fill in the wholes through the draft and FA. If a better defensive coordinator is available sign him.

Once I see consistency, I will regain hope. Beat the teams your supposed to beat. We have a lot of division games still.


Plus side I the Jordan Reed is going to be a really good offensive tight end. Lowers cap room without Davis.

Just thought if were out of playoff contention in December. Have Kirk Cousins start and have him audition for teams and get a 1st or 2nd round draft pick for him (this is not realistic though) lol.


EA7649 for the life of me can you please explain your thought process? in the 4 years Shanahan has been here what has he done to merit another year? What has Haslett, Burns or any other coach on this staff done to merit more time? This type of things that has gone on is what you expect from a new coach, not someone that is supposed to be some offensive guru genius. In life one thing that a mature person learns, processes and understands is you don't fix what isn't broken. Shanahan did that with the 4th rated defense the first year coming here. That is but one issue that for me can't be swept under the rug, Cap gate is another issue. Now as my "third" strike after last year, to be this far into the season and not take play calling away from that downed syndrome Forrest Gump looking son of his is the last straw that broke this camels back. This team will not get any better FACT, we need a young coaching staff that has a kill first mentality on the field, not some arrogant butt whiffs who use the same memo week after week talking about practicing to get better, you can practice 24 by 7 but if the teachers or the coaches are crap, then you field what is learned and taught. All these people on here screaming for Cousins, screaming for players, IT'S NOT THE PLAYERS ITS THE COACHING STAFF and last night pretty much nails that FACT in the coffin of the 2013 season....... [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X


We have wholes in the defense like defensive backs. I didn't really say much about Shanahans ability to coach with my post. I said if there is a better defensive coach available sign him. Shanahan has been alright coach, but I think his son has been a better offensive coordinator than his dad as a coach. But I mostly agree with what you said, but we do have wholes in the team with players skills and not being penalized 18million of cap space will be a good thing. And I was saying play Cousins if we are out of playoff contention to get him for a high draft pick, than sign another decent quarterback this draft. If we are in playoff contention than of course play RG3.

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Re: What Happened???

Postby Countertrey » Fri Nov 08, 2013 5:15 pm

Deadskins wrote:
ACW wrote:I'm serious here; I went to bed at halftime... How'd we lose? :?:

You went to bed at halftime. You stay up, we win that game.

You have broken the code! :shock:
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Re: What Happened???

Postby Countertrey » Fri Nov 08, 2013 5:20 pm

Chris Luva Luva wrote:I can blame both the offense and the defense and that's exactly what I'm going to do.

The offense scored 3 points in the second half, that's not going to cut it.
The defense couldn't stop a runaway tricycle.

I don't take issue with blaming either side, it's the lopsided nature of the criticisms that make my skin crawl. Just like when people blame Kyle for not running the ball but RGIII misses an open receiver. Let's paint and discuss the picture in it's entirety.

You said in another thread that folks were misreading your statements about Bob... yet, here it is again... Bob played a very good game last night, and his stats back it up. No one passes that many times without missing a few... Fact... O line sucked. Fact... D couldn't stop a snail at 1/2 gallop... but, the other facts are Bob played a very nice game (including an excellent read and audible that resulted in Garcon's touchdown, and an excellent job of playing the DB that yielded Reed's touchdown... AND... Kyle called a very nice game.
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Re: What Happened???

Postby welch » Fri Nov 08, 2013 6:43 pm

I've got no serious answer. Numbers say that the Redskins scored about 3 points in 2H and the Other Team scored about 20. Not yet good enough on offense and defense. My instinct says that this is a 7 - 9 or 8 - 8 team and "wait till next year". Painful, and I'm impatient. I expected a rollout on the last couple of plays, but the game should not have come to that.

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Re: What Happened???

Postby Countertrey » Fri Nov 08, 2013 9:21 pm

welch wrote:I've got no serious answer. Numbers say that the Redskins scored about 3 points in 2H and the Other Team scored about 20. Not yet good enough on offense and defense. My instinct says that this is a 7 - 9 or 8 - 8 team and "wait till next year". Painful, and I'm impatient. I expected a rollout on the last couple of plays, but the game should not have come to that.

Of COURSE you're impatient... you're old as hell!
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Re: What Happened???

Postby StorminMormon86 » Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:48 am

Countertrey wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:I can blame both the offense and the defense and that's exactly what I'm going to do.

The offense scored 3 points in the second half, that's not going to cut it.
The defense couldn't stop a runaway tricycle.

I don't take issue with blaming either side, it's the lopsided nature of the criticisms that make my skin crawl. Just like when people blame Kyle for not running the ball but RGIII misses an open receiver. Let's paint and discuss the picture in it's entirety.

You said in another thread that folks were misreading your statements about Bob... yet, here it is again... Bob played a very good game last night, and his stats back it up. No one passes that many times without missing a few... Fact... O line sucked. Fact... D couldn't stop a snail at 1/2 gallop... but, the other facts are Bob played a very nice game (including an excellent read and audible that resulted in Garcon's touchdown, and an excellent job of playing the DB that yielded Reed's touchdown... AND... Kyle called a very nice game.

I think his point was that Kyle gets all of the blame after a loss and Griffin is absolved from any wrongdoing. But if we win there's not one mention of how great of a game Kyle called on offense. Yes Griffin did have an awesome game in the first half. He got murdered in the 2nd half.

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Re: What Happened???

Postby Irn-Bru » Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:27 am

chiefhog44 wrote:What happened was that we lost a game we should have won. Very disappointing. We now have the feeling like we did 5 years ago under Zorn. A new low. What happened was that we lost a game that now forces us us to evaulate the COACHES. and why not? Do you think they should be given a pass for the salary cap penalty? Who was ultimately responsible for that? Shanny and Allen.


Shanny and Allen are responsible for a contract Vinny Cerrato wrote and which the league unjustly and unfairly punished us for?

News to me. I'd be interested to hear your thinking on this point.


Pass for the lack of talent on defense? Again Shanny and Allen.

I think the salary cap penalty bears a large part of the blame here. If you don't think $36 million matters, well, OK, but I do.

No first round pick this year or next? You guessed it...Shanny and Allen.

You seem to think this is blameworthy. What that means is that you wish we didn't have RGIII on the team. What's your backup plan? I suppose you'l say something like "I would have drafted Russell Wilson," but somehow I doubt you were quite as eagle-eyed in 2011. Maybe you've got a post you can drag up to prove me wrong, though. I'm happy to give credit where it is due.

Give me RGIII. I don't think that was a bad trade, given that we didn't get lucky like the Colts or the Seahawks. The Browns, who lost out on the chance to trade even though they would have given more than us, ended up with a horrendous draft. Who would we have gotten instead? Tannehill? (God forbid) Weeden?

The special Teams Coordinator and maybe even Haslett needs to be fired if we don't end the season going 5-2. The punt fake was almost as bad as the swinging gate (or whatever it was a call). That's what happened.

Agreed that our special teams are a total mess. Perhaps Danny Smith wasn't as bad as we all thought, and he was in fact keeping his finger in the dike to prevent a total disaster.

I love Rocca, but he's no longer serviceable. I love Cobra Kai, but I just don't think he has the power to make it in this league. Sucks that we need to replace both positions. One of these days we'll hit the lottery with our random signings.

I also agree that Haslett needs to go. Yes, he hasn't had the talent to work with, but we really should have seen more from him by now.
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Re: What Happened???

Postby Irn-Bru » Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:28 am

Countertrey wrote:
welch wrote:I've got no serious answer. Numbers say that the Redskins scored about 3 points in 2H and the Other Team scored about 20. Not yet good enough on offense and defense. My instinct says that this is a 7 - 9 or 8 - 8 team and "wait till next year". Painful, and I'm impatient. I expected a rollout on the last couple of plays, but the game should not have come to that.

Of COURSE you're impatient... you're old as hell!


The bullying never stops, does it . . . [-X

I keep telling you, 'Trey, you'll never get that milk money back. It's gone. :(
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Re: What Happened???

Postby SkinsJock » Sat Nov 09, 2013 4:17 pm

we have shown some promise this season but it's not been consistent ..

we lost to a team that we could have easily beaten and we did lose this game, the Vikings did not exactly win it
the whole team (coaches & players) let everyone down, big time - not good enough on both sides of the ball - you cannot ONLY score 3 against that bunch in the second half - why were we not ramming the ball down their throat and why was Ponder and stupid Cassel looking like all pros out there?

last week we played 'better' than the Chargers and we almost lost that game

we should be seeing more from our coaches and players this season - this is actually a better group than the team that won the NFC East

very disappointing to see Robert having the issues he's having in going through this transition to become a more rounded QB but that being said we do have talent on both sides of the ball and things are not going well

I don't know who is primarily at fault here but it would seem that the coaches have got to get their act together because the players are 'staying" and there are a bunch of them that we should be seeing better play from

I'm not advocating firing Haslett or anyone - the coaches need to find a way to get things together because ultimately they are responsible for getting more out of the players - that's just a fact of life in the NFL

I know we were badly strapped by the cap hit but at the same time we have a better group of both players and coaches than last season and we're not seeing it
RG3 is now learning how to play QB in the NFL - Mike & Kyle did not help with the transition

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Re: What Happened???

Postby Kilmer72 » Sat Nov 09, 2013 7:05 pm

IMO Hasletts biggest deficiency is making adjustments on the fly. He is no Gregg Williams. He sometimes has good game plans. Then there are those games that the opposing offense adjusts and he has no answer. Special teams is another story. Our offense is just fine as long as they do not deviate from what is working or what we do best. You can't run the ball every down, but that doesn't mean forget about it either. Life is so much easier for the QB when you can run the ball.

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Re: What Happened???

Postby Countertrey » Sat Nov 09, 2013 7:29 pm

Irn-Bru wrote:
Countertrey wrote:
welch wrote:I've got no serious answer. Numbers say that the Redskins scored about 3 points in 2H and the Other Team scored about 20. Not yet good enough on offense and defense. My instinct says that this is a 7 - 9 or 8 - 8 team and "wait till next year". Painful, and I'm impatient. I expected a rollout on the last couple of plays, but the game should not have come to that.

Of COURSE you're impatient... you're old as hell!


The bullying never stops, does it . . . [-X

I keep telling you, 'Trey, you'll never get that milk money back. It's gone. :(

It's not bullying if you're simply stating facts! ... and, I'm expecting 2 cents to show up in my mailbox at any time... yes, milk was very expensive in the '50's...
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Re: What Happened???

Postby chiefhog44 » Sat Nov 09, 2013 7:35 pm

Irn-Bru wrote:
chiefhog44 wrote:What happened was that we lost a game we should have won. Very disappointing. We now have the feeling like we did 5 years ago under Zorn. A new low. What happened was that we lost a game that now forces us us to evaulate the COACHES. and why not? Do you think they should be given a pass for the salary cap penalty? Who was ultimately responsible for that? Shanny and Allen.


Shanny and Allen are responsible for a contract Vinny Cerrato wrote and which the league unjustly and unfairly punished us for?

News to me. I'd be interested to hear your thinking on this point.


Pass for the lack of talent on defense? Again Shanny and Allen.

I think the salary cap penalty bears a large part of the blame here. If you don't think $36 million matters, well, OK, but I do.

No first round pick this year or next? You guessed it...Shanny and Allen.

You seem to think this is blameworthy. What that means is that you wish we didn't have RGIII on the team. What's your backup plan? I suppose you'l say something like "I would have drafted Russell Wilson," but somehow I doubt you were quite as eagle-eyed in 2011. Maybe you've got a post you can drag up to prove me wrong, though. I'm happy to give credit where it is due.

Give me RGIII. I don't think that was a bad trade, given that we didn't get lucky like the Colts or the Seahawks. The Browns, who lost out on the chance to trade even though they would have given more than us, ended up with a horrendous draft. Who would we have gotten instead? Tannehill? (God forbid) Weeden?

The special Teams Coordinator and maybe even Haslett needs to be fired if we don't end the season going 5-2. The punt fake was almost as bad as the swinging gate (or whatever it was a call). That's what happened.

Agreed that our special teams are a total mess. Perhaps Danny Smith wasn't as bad as we all thought, and he was in fact keeping his finger in the dike to prevent a total disaster.

I love Rocca, but he's no longer serviceable. I love Cobra Kai, but I just don't think he has the power to make it in this league. Sucks that we need to replace both positions. One of these days we'll hit the lottery with our random signings.

I also agree that Haslett needs to go. Yes, he hasn't had the talent to work with, but we really should have seen more from him by now.


They tried to frontload the contracts of both Hanesworth (and I believe Hall) to accelerate their contracts in a year that was deemed to have an unspoken salary cap. I agree that we got hosed, but this has been upheld by the league, the union, and the courts, so ultimately, I think the blame rests on the person or people in this case, that were trying to "work" the system. Correct me if I'm wrong on that though. This would then be carried over to the lack of talent on the defense since I hear people say, well, we had a salary cap hit of 36 million so we suck on defense. Not having 1st round picks also can not be used as an excuse as they were the ones that gave them away.

Simply put, when are these coaches going to be judged on their work and have no more excuses???
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Re: What Happened???

Postby Countertrey » Sat Nov 09, 2013 7:49 pm

chiefhog44 wrote:

They tried to frontload the contracts of both Hanesworth (and I believe Hall) to accelerate their contracts in a year that was deemed to have an unspoken salary cap. I agree that we got hosed, but this has been upheld by the league, the union, and the courts, so ultimately, I think the blame rests on the person or people in this case, that were trying to "work" the system. Correct me if I'm wrong on that though. This would then be carried over to the lack of talent on the defense since I hear people say, well, we had a salary cap hit of 36 million so we suck on defense. Not having 1st round picks also can not be used as an excuse as they were the ones that gave them away.

Simply put, when are these coaches going to be judged on their work and have no more excuses???

If you want to make this argument, at least be honest about it... The league signed off, because it's corrupt. The union signed off... and has since made statements that suggest regrets... they screwed up. The courts have NOT ruled on the merits of this event... the master simply said that he has no jurisdiction in this matter. Snyder did not take it further, because that would risk killing the golden goose... and possibly cause the loss of antitrust protections the league (and Snyder) currently enjoys.
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