Brian Orakpo - LB

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby Neo » Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:36 pm

I'm on the fence about this one. If we would have lost him, it would have been a negative for us. Its just that I'm not too fond of how expensive he was to keep.

After all, we have paid him to be injured for what, nearly two seasons or something? Doesn't he owe this team?

Anyway, just wanted to vent that out...welcome back Rak! :) Keep your @$$ healthy or else!
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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby DarthMonk » Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:45 pm

The Hogster wrote:
DarthMonk wrote:Different players have different levels of commitment to excellence.

If Haynesworth was a zero and Art Monk was a 10, what is Rak?

This money will make him more of whatever he is now.

What is he?


Based on known information about him. The positive is that he's been considered a workout beast at least since his UT days, so I don't think he lacks work ethic or a commitment to the gym. But, I have heard him say in an interview something like "You won't see me doing any spin moves or anything like that. I just do what I do." That raised an eyebrow for me because my personal view of him is that he only has a couple of moves. He bull rushes, dips shoulder to the outside, or winds up stuck on a block. In my opinion, if he were more committed to developing his arsenal of moves/techniques, he'd take the leap to elite. But, if he thinks he can just over power people or run by them, he'll be a 10 sack guy which is good but not near great. The elite guys can beat you with both power and finesse. He hasn't done that.

But, I don't think he's the kind of player that will be changed by the money if that's what you mean. He'll still be a gym rat. I just think he needs to work on his weaknesses or else he's probably at his ceiling. At his age, he's not going to get much stronger or faster...he's got to find other ways to beat people.

Hell, even Michael Jordan developed a fadeaway jumper that was unstoppable later in his career. What makes Rak think he's any different.


Just the kind of reply I was hoping for. In conjunction with the one after yours I'd say an 8 is about right. Didn't think it would change him at all. These big contracts don't change people - they just show what people really are even more. I'm thinking he will work hard but may not be quite dedicated (or talented?) enough to truly improve his craft.
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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby Chris Luva Luva » Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:45 am

Players don't come from college equipped with everything that they need. I think of Champ Bailey talking about how D. Green is a main contributor to his success. Who did Orakpo have when he came here? It doesn't have to be a player, it can be coaching. That being said, we brought in a OLB coach to work with Kerrigan and Orakpo specifically. Hopefully the coach is good and the players are receptive to good coaching.
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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby The Hogster » Tue Mar 04, 2014 10:00 am

Here's a video clip where a guy points out what I said in the previous post. Orakpo is far above average at his two moves. The problem is, he only has two moves that he uses effectively. If he can be a 10 sack guy just using his bull rush and speed rush, he could become elite if he developed a more complete game. He barely ever uses a club move, or an inside or outside spin move.

I give him a pass for not using an outside spin much given the gap discipline that a 3-4 requires. But, I can't understand why a guy who is so good at speed rushing to the outside and bull rushing wouldn't set up his inside spin by taking advantage of the tackle getting off balance expecting his speed rush or bull rush which he uses 90 percent of the time.

If he adds a couple more moves to his arsenal, I see no reason why he can't get another 5 or so sacks per year. 15 sacks is in that elite category. 10 is just very good. He's very good right now. But, wants to be paid like he's elite.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpdSDvfl_Yg
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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby riggofan » Tue Mar 04, 2014 11:22 am

I'm still a little torn when I read these comments that Orakpo is "not worth the money". I think I disagree with that. If we're overpaying for Rak, I would argue that we're not GROSSLY overpaying him. He's good, he's young, he's a homegrown guy, and we're not creating another hole on the defense by letting him walk.

There are other teams around the league who would pay $10-$11m to take him from us, so I don't think its true that we're overpaying him. The real concern about the money for Rak is just that we have so many other needs to fill this offseason. Can we afford to pay him?

Here's my question for you guys. What do you need to see from Orakpo this year to make this deal worth the money? (Rak was tied for 6th in the league with 10 sacks last year.) Or is it more about seeing the defense as a whole improve?

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby Chris Luva Luva » Tue Mar 04, 2014 11:25 am

The Hogster wrote:Here's a video clip where a guy points out what I said in the previous post. Orakpo is far above average at his two moves. The problem is, he only has two moves that he uses effectively. If he can be a 10 sack guy just using his bull rush and speed rush, he could become elite if he developed a more complete game. He barely ever uses a club move, or an inside or outside spin move.


This is where I hope the new coach comes in. Baltimore isn't drafting guys who know every move in the book. They have one system, it works and the players are taught.


The Hogster wrote:I give him a pass for not using an outside spin much given the gap discipline that a 3-4 requires.


Which brings to mind what Haz said in a recent interview. Our guys are worried too much about contain, he's about to let them loose and put more responsibility elsewhere.


The Hogster wrote:If he adds a couple more moves to his arsenal, I see no reason why he can't get another 5 or so sacks per year. 15 sacks is in that elite category. 10 is just very good. He's very good right now. But, wants to be paid like he's elite.


And he's very good without a true NT..., that says a lot.



Thanks for the link.
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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby The Hogster » Tue Mar 04, 2014 2:03 pm

riggofan wrote:Here's my question for you guys. What do you need to see from Orakpo this year to make this deal worth the money? (Rak was tied for 6th in the league with 10 sacks last year.) Or is it more about seeing the defense as a whole improve?


I want to see him become the leader of this defense. When you're the highest paid defensive player, I think leadership must be that attribute that plays into justification for that kind of money--especially since London Fletcher is no longer there. He's now the most senior linebacker, highest paid, and most physically gifted. But, he's got to improve his weaknesses.

Which brings me to the second thing I want to see from him. More versatility. He's somewhat of a one-trick pony. I want to see him add more moves to his arsenal, and improve in coverage. Ryan Kerrigan has a knack for making plays (tipped balls, interceptions, forced fumbles)

I want to see Orakpo become the noticeably best player on our defense and make the team want to sign him to a long-term extension if they don't before this season begins.
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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby riggofan » Tue Mar 04, 2014 2:26 pm

The Hogster wrote:
riggofan wrote:Here's my question for you guys. What do you need to see from Orakpo this year to make this deal worth the money? (Rak was tied for 6th in the league with 10 sacks last year.) Or is it more about seeing the defense as a whole improve?


I want to see him become the leader of this defense. When you're the highest paid defensive player, I think leadership must be that attribute that plays into justification for that kind of money--especially since London Fletcher is no longer there. He's now the most senior linebacker, highest paid, and most physically gifted. But, he's got to improve his weaknesses.

Which brings me to the second thing I want to see from him. More versatility. He's somewhat of a one-trick pony. I want to see him add more moves to his arsenal, and improve in coverage. Ryan Kerrigan has a knack for making plays (tipped balls, interceptions, forced fumbles)

I want to see Orakpo become the noticeably best player on our defense and make the team want to sign him to a long-term extension if they don't before this season begins.


Good answers, man. I like it - especially your comment about leadership.

I agree about seeing him become the "noticeably best player on our defense". I want to see multiple games this season where Rak is causing trouble for our opponents. I want to see a couple real "monster" games.

Btw I heard C00ley respond to the comment about Orakpo being a one trick pony. He said Orakpo is actually a two-trick pony because he is really good against the run.

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby riggofan » Tue Mar 04, 2014 2:36 pm

Food for thought (which might make you sick):

Since 1983, only 3 #Redskins first-round picks have signed 2nd contracts w/the team—Arrington, Samuels, and Darrell Green. - via Rich Tandler

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby Kilmer72 » Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:24 pm

Here is to hoping that RAK can sack Foles,Eli and Romo 95% of the 10 or 11 sacks he gets. That is the only part of the money spent that bothers me. He may not learn new tricks. He hasn't learned to get out of holds (not enough moves). I like Rak and I am happy he is still here and I think the Franchise Tag was the way to go. I can't see him averaging 10 mil a year. That is was too much. I wish we had the luxury to pay like that. 1 year FT deal and now he has to perform a whole season.

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby DarthMonk » Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:09 pm

I wonder what kind of deal we could have struck with him when he was recovering from his 2nd torn pec.
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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby blowwad » Thu Mar 06, 2014 3:40 pm

riggofan wrote:Food for thought (which might make you sick):

Since 1983, only 3 #Redskins first-round picks have signed 2nd contracts w/the team—Arrington, Samuels, and Darrell Green. - via Rich Tandler



12 of those years we didn't have a first round draft pick

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby riggofan » Thu Mar 06, 2014 4:58 pm

blowwad wrote:
riggofan wrote:Food for thought (which might make you sick):

Since 1983, only 3 #Redskins first-round picks have signed 2nd contracts w/the team—Arrington, Samuels, and Darrell Green. - via Rich Tandler



12 of those years we didn't have a first round draft pick


lol. Not surprising! But okay, I'm not sure that 3 first rounds picks sticking out of 18 is much to brag about either.

That 12 years number is crazy btw. That means nearly half of the past thirty years we haven't had a first round pick for some reason. Is that right?

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby riggofan » Thu Mar 27, 2014 9:11 am

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -tag-deal/
The Redskins announced that the pass-rusher had signed his one-year, $11.455 million deal, guaranteeing the amount for the season.


Good deal. I'm happy Rak will be there for off season workouts now!

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Re: Brian Orakpo - LB

Postby Deadskins » Fri Apr 18, 2014 12:48 pm

Andre Carter wrote:Damn man, you know your football.


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