What are the odds...

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Re: What are the odds...

Postby yupchagee » Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:53 pm

Thundersloth wrote:The Redskins try to pick up John Lynch? I don't think he wants more than a league minimum base salary with lots of incentives. Or has he lost a step and is too old?


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Postby Thundersloth » Wed Sep 03, 2008 4:59 pm

Kazoo, I'm just frustrated with the way the team has made personnel decisions in the past and the draft picks we've wasted by trading for the flavor of the month guy and not reaping the benefits of those draft picks. Not all of the signings have been bad ones, but overall it seems like we've been a rudderless ship going nowhere.

Changing coaches makes it very difficult to be successful since you have new guys coming in with their philosophies and ideas which may not fit the personnel you have.

And why was it sooooo hard to realize you need to have a GM? If there had been a GM we could have had someone to blame officially.

I'll be cheering for the Redskins tomorrow night to beat the Giants and every other team they play (especially Dallas) this season. But the past track record of bad moves has piled up and that's the place where change needs to start and it seems like a weak spot to me.
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Postby KazooSkinsFan » Wed Sep 03, 2008 6:01 pm

Thundersloth wrote:Kazoo, I'm just frustrated with the way the team has made personnel decisions in the past and the draft picks we've wasted by trading for the flavor of the month guy and not reaping the benefits of those draft picks. Not all of the signings have been bad ones, but overall it seems like we've been a rudderless ship going nowhere.

Changing coaches makes it very difficult to be successful since you have new guys coming in with their philosophies and ideas which may not fit the personnel you have.

And why was it sooooo hard to realize you need to have a GM? If there had been a GM we could have had someone to blame officially.

I'll be cheering for the Redskins tomorrow night to beat the Giants and every other team they play (especially Dallas) this season. But the past track record of bad moves has piled up and that's the place where change needs to start and it seems like a weak spot to me.

All I'm saying is why is every over the hill free agent like Lynch, even ones we haven't signed, like Lynch, another chance to take a shot? I don't understand endless BLASTING of the team. Especially in pre-season. And especially with a new coach. I'm looking forward to just seeing if we can start to build some momentum this year with a coach who seems like a good, smart guy and hopefully will be around a long time to build a good program.

Snyder hasn't found much success, but Zorn seems to be a good pick. He got rid of Norv (good move). He tried the control freak, the hot college prospect, HOFer II. Now he's picked a guy with a solid NFL playing and coaching background who seems like a great fit. Why not just give it a shot rather then take one?
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Postby Thundersloth » Wed Sep 03, 2008 11:01 pm

But isn't that kind of the point, we've been giving these guys (ownership) a shot year after year and it seems like we're starting from square 1 all of the time. So you get rid of Norv after the 13th game of the season????? Robiske never really had a shot to keep the job.
Marty (8-8)comes in fires Vinny and seems to have the team on the right track...then he gets fired in favor of the OBC (12-20) and we all know how that ended. Joe Gibbs (30-34) comes back and everybody's excited (including myself) but this time around the game has really changed. Under the current ownership, not one coach has had an overall winning record unless you count Norv's 7-6 record before getting canned.

I agree with you, I think Zorn can be a great coach but take a look at how he got this job. Hired as the OC then the HC two weeks later??? That doesn't seem like ownership was very high on him or else he would've been hired as the HC right off the bat right???? And that's what really scares me, how much confidence does ownership have in him and how willing are they to get rid of him if the Redskins don't have a winning record after this season? Then we'll have to give the NEXT guy a shot.
If you're mad at your kid, you can either raise him to be a nose tackle or send him out to play on the freeway. It's about the same. ~Bob Golic

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Postby 1niksder » Wed Sep 03, 2008 11:57 pm

Thundersloth wrote:But isn't that kind of the point, we've been giving these guys (ownership) a shot year after year and it seems like we're starting from square 1 all of the time. So you get rid of Norv after the 13th game of the season????? Robiske never really had a shot to keep the job.
Marty (8-8)comes in fires Vinny and seems to have the team on the right track...then he gets fired in favor of the OBC (12-20) and we all know how that ended. Joe Gibbs (30-34) comes back and everybody's excited (including myself) but this time around the game has really changed. Under the current ownership, not one coach has had an overall winning record unless you count Norv's 7-6 record before getting canned.

I agree with you, I think Zorn can be a great coach but take a look at how he got this job. Hired as the OC then the HC two weeks later??? That doesn't seem like ownership was very high on him or else he would've been hired as the HC right off the bat right???? And that's what really scares me, how much confidence does ownership have in him and how willing are they to get rid of him if the Redskins don't have a winning record after this season? Then we'll have to give the NEXT guy a shot.


You been ducking fallen clouds for too long Thundersloth, The season has to start before we'll know anything (if then). Sure Marty should have never been fired but it's time to move past that. SOS wasn't in and out in fact he was left to run the team for too long, Gibbs still had a year on his 5 year deal when he left. Marty had all the power and Steve didn't want any. JJG came in and gave it balance (even with Vinny around). When he came back he brought in players that first year that are still producing for the team now. Not sure who was really behind Lloyd and AA but it was a learning experience for somebody. A lasting lesson at that, as those where the last bonehead moves made. Recent years show them getting players in free agency that they need instead of a name they can use. They have added players through the draft that have produced each of the four years that Gibbs was here. Gibbs took them to the post season two of the four years he was here. We have to give credit where credit is due. In other words I've stopped thinking "the Danny" is a idiot I think he is a slow learner.

I don't see what the problem is with the way Zorn was hired. He was the prefect guy to bring in to get JC right. Offering him the OC spot was one of the only ways to get him out of Seattle. The slow learner still wanted a big name to run the ship at that time. At some point Zorn may have done what the fan base has been hoping for since the return of Vinny. It's "the Danny" that is the big name now and Zorn may have convinced him that he doesn't have to spend a ton of money on another big name to stand out front.
Who knows how it all came about, but what would the locker room have been like if someone else was hired as HC. He wouldn't have had he own OC... "Who's really in charge?" would have been a common question at Redskins park. There was almost no turn over in the coaching staff, and the team got younger, with less than 30% turnover.

20 or so players on the roster are players drafted by the Redskins in the last four years or so, then throw in Wilson, Heyer, Alexander, Geisinger and a few others that they picked up off the streets and you can't say they aren't moving in the right direction.

During a time that I try to forget a starting player went down during the preseason they traded two picks and got TJ Duckett, A player went down this year.... They traded three picks and got Erasmus James and Jason Taylor.

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Postby Thundersloth » Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:26 am

That's a GREAT point about Dannyboy being a slow learner. You wouldn't expect that since he's such a successful "Captain of Industry". But it seems like it would easy to look around the league and see that most teams have a GM or in our case a Vice President of Football Operations (Vinny Cerrato).

Believe it or not, I really hate to be negative (hard to believe, I know with the posts in this thread) but I can't help but question some of the decisions made especially with Head Coaches.

But 1niksder you've opened my eyes a bit and helped me understand some things about Dannyboy.
If you're mad at your kid, you can either raise him to be a nose tackle or send him out to play on the freeway. It's about the same. ~Bob Golic

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