D'Angelo Hall Ticked, Addresses Pats Play

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Postby The Hogster » Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:21 pm

Red_One43 wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:That's a very telling group of stats.


DeAngelo Hall
Tackles: 85
Interceptions: 3 0 TD
Passes Defended: 14
Forced Fumbles: 1

Darrell Revis
Tackles: 49
Interceptions: 4 1 TD
Passes Defended: 14
Forced Fumbles: 0

Namdi Asogmua
Tackles: 49
Interceptions: 3 0 TD
Passes Defended: 5
Forced Fumbles: 0

Charles Woodson
Tackles: 70
Interceptions: 7 1 TD
Passes Defended: 16
Forced Fumbles: 1

Added these Stats for Comparison purposes:

Josh Wilson
Tackles: 56
Interceptions: 2 0 TD
Passes Defended: 15
Forced Fumbles: 0

Jason McCourty - TN
Tackles: 90
Ints: 2 0 TD
Passes Defended: 10
Forced Fumbles: 1

Charles Tillman CHI
Tackles: 88
INTS: 2 1 TD
PD: 13
FF: 3

Kyle Arrington NE
Tackles: 77
INTS: 7 0 TD
PD: 19
FF: 0

Devin McCourty NE
Tackles: 73
INTS: 0
PD: 0
FF: 0

I have added Wilson who I think is developing into a good corner for us. I also added the the rest of the top four CBs in tackles (includes Hall at #3). I also included D.McCourty NE as to show a tandem along with Hall and Wilson. Added INT TDs to the mix. I added all of those players and the TDS to see what conclusions I could come up with the stats posted by Hogster.

What do you find that is very telling about the stats posted by Hogster?

I find that without including "missed tackles" or "completion yardage against" such as the burn rate below, the stats do not tell us who is the best corner. Is Arrington with 77 tackles and 7 INTS better than Hall? These stats don't prove it - all they say is he is having a better season and get him recognition for the pro bowl.

I do give Hall his credit as a corner that will step up and make that tackle where a lot of corners will not.

What do you think about the Burn Rate pass defense analysis? I assume another one will come out for 2011 when the season is done. As you review it, you will see that Hall's ranking matches how he plays in man coverage.

Thanks to our friends at STATS, Inc., we have the "Burn Rate" for each NFL pass defender in 2010 — the percentage of targets for every defender that resulted in catches. These numbers do bring out many of the best and worst players and the film generally agrees,


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdo ... nfl-wp2995


That's the thing. I am not saying that Hall is the best corner in the league. He is what he is. Coverage wise he would be be most comparable to Asante Samuel in my view. Cat quick, with good vision and anticipation but plays better in zone coverage where he can see what's in front of him and react. Hall is average in man coverage. In man you are playing in tighter areas where speed is not as great an asset. You're also playing with your back to the QB and not facing him. Running with receivers, requires a different skill set than playing in zone. He can play man to man, but that's his weak point.

That's what prevents him from being a Top 3-5 corner. I'm pointing out with those statistics how reputation & perception becomes reality for some fans. But, perception is often wrong. Some fans don't understand the game and judge based on limited knowledge. That leads to over reactions about certain players--Hall being one.
SPIT HAPPENS!!
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Postby Red_One43 » Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:07 am

The Hogster wrote:
Red_One43 wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:That's a very telling group of stats.


DeAngelo Hall
Tackles: 85
Interceptions: 3 0 TD
Passes Defended: 14
Forced Fumbles: 1

Darrell Revis
Tackles: 49
Interceptions: 4 1 TD
Passes Defended: 14
Forced Fumbles: 0

Namdi Asogmua
Tackles: 49
Interceptions: 3 0 TD
Passes Defended: 5
Forced Fumbles: 0

Charles Woodson
Tackles: 70
Interceptions: 7 1 TD
Passes Defended: 16
Forced Fumbles: 1

Added these Stats for Comparison purposes:

Josh Wilson
Tackles: 56
Interceptions: 2 0 TD
Passes Defended: 15
Forced Fumbles: 0

Jason McCourty - TN
Tackles: 90
Ints: 2 0 TD
Passes Defended: 10
Forced Fumbles: 1

Charles Tillman CHI
Tackles: 88
INTS: 2 1 TD
PD: 13
FF: 3

Kyle Arrington NE
Tackles: 77
INTS: 7 0 TD
PD: 19
FF: 0

Devin McCourty NE
Tackles: 73
INTS: 0
PD: 0
FF: 0

I have added Wilson who I think is developing into a good corner for us. I also added the the rest of the top four CBs in tackles (includes Hall at #3). I also included D.McCourty NE as to show a tandem along with Hall and Wilson. Added INT TDs to the mix. I added all of those players and the TDS to see what conclusions I could come up with the stats posted by Hogster.

What do you find that is very telling about the stats posted by Hogster?

I find that without including "missed tackles" or "completion yardage against" such as the burn rate below, the stats do not tell us who is the best corner. Is Arrington with 77 tackles and 7 INTS better than Hall? These stats don't prove it - all they say is he is having a better season and get him recognition for the pro bowl.

I do give Hall his credit as a corner that will step up and make that tackle where a lot of corners will not.

What do you think about the Burn Rate pass defense analysis? I assume another one will come out for 2011 when the season is done. As you review it, you will see that Hall's ranking matches how he plays in man coverage.

Thanks to our friends at STATS, Inc., we have the "Burn Rate" for each NFL pass defender in 2010 — the percentage of targets for every defender that resulted in catches. These numbers do bring out many of the best and worst players and the film generally agrees,


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdo ... nfl-wp2995


That's the thing. I am not saying that Hall is the best corner in the league. He is what he is. Coverage wise he would be be most comparable to Asante Samuel in my view. Cat quick, with good vision and anticipation but plays better in zone coverage where he can see what's in front of him and react. Hall is average in man coverage. In man you are playing in tighter areas where speed is not as great an asset. You're also playing with your back to the QB and not facing him. Running with receivers, requires a different skill set than playing in zone. He can play man to man, but that's his weak point.

That's what prevents him from being a Top 3-5 corner. I'm pointing out with those statistics how reputation & perception becomes reality for some fans. But, perception is often wrong. Some fans don't understand the game and judge based on limited knowledge. That leads to over reactions about certain players--Hall being one.


I agree with you that Hall's reputation lends to folks knocking him as a corner. I admit that I sometimes get caught up in that, but then I say, "DeAngelo is DeAngelo" which means, you take the good and the bad. I also forget that he is not that old, so he can bounce back and have a better year next year just like other players who don't have their usual year. The CB FA market is weak this year. To me Grimes is the only one worth considering, but given his injury and the way Hall keeps bouncing back from adversity, I would say that he will be back next year. Even if we draft a CB in the lower rounds, with the rookie wage scale we can afford to keep Hall while the rookie develops. I think the Gronk play did bother Hall, he knows it at the very least made him look bad, so I think we will see the best of Hall these last two games like we saw last week.

Thanks for posting the stats. I totally get your point.
Last edited by Red_One43 on Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby The Hogster » Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:28 am

Red_One43 wrote:
The Hogster wrote:
Red_One43 wrote:
Chris Luva Luva wrote:That's a very telling group of stats.


DeAngelo Hall
Tackles: 85
Interceptions: 3 0 TD
Passes Defended: 14
Forced Fumbles: 1

Darrell Revis
Tackles: 49
Interceptions: 4 1 TD
Passes Defended: 14
Forced Fumbles: 0

Namdi Asogmua
Tackles: 49
Interceptions: 3 0 TD
Passes Defended: 5
Forced Fumbles: 0

Charles Woodson
Tackles: 70
Interceptions: 7 1 TD
Passes Defended: 16
Forced Fumbles: 1

Added these Stats for Comparison purposes:

Josh Wilson
Tackles: 56
Interceptions: 2 0 TD
Passes Defended: 15
Forced Fumbles: 0

Jason McCourty - TN
Tackles: 90
Ints: 2 0 TD
Passes Defended: 10
Forced Fumbles: 1

Charles Tillman CHI
Tackles: 88
INTS: 2 1 TD
PD: 13
FF: 3

Kyle Arrington NE
Tackles: 77
INTS: 7 0 TD
PD: 19
FF: 0

Devin McCourty NE
Tackles: 73
INTS: 0
PD: 0
FF: 0

I have added Wilson who I think is developing into a good corner for us. I also added the the rest of the top four CBs in tackles (includes Hall at #3). I also included D.McCourty NE as to show a tandem along with Hall and Wilson. Added INT TDs to the mix. I added all of those players and the TDS to see what conclusions I could come up with the stats posted by Hogster.

What do you find that is very telling about the stats posted by Hogster?

I find that without including "missed tackles" or "completion yardage against" such as the burn rate below, the stats do not tell us who is the best corner. Is Arrington with 77 tackles and 7 INTS better than Hall? These stats don't prove it - all they say is he is having a better season and get him recognition for the pro bowl.

I do give Hall his credit as a corner that will step up and make that tackle where a lot of corners will not.

What do you think about the Burn Rate pass defense analysis? I assume another one will come out for 2011 when the season is done. As you review it, you will see that Hall's ranking matches how he plays in man coverage.

Thanks to our friends at STATS, Inc., we have the "Burn Rate" for each NFL pass defender in 2010 — the percentage of targets for every defender that resulted in catches. These numbers do bring out many of the best and worst players and the film generally agrees,


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdo ... nfl-wp2995


That's the thing. I am not saying that Hall is the best corner in the league. He is what he is. Coverage wise he would be be most comparable to Asante Samuel in my view. Cat quick, with good vision and anticipation but plays better in zone coverage where he can see what's in front of him and react. Hall is average in man coverage. In man you are playing in tighter areas where speed is not as great an asset. You're also playing with your back to the QB and not facing him. Running with receivers, requires a different skill set than playing in zone. He can play man to man, but that's his weak point.

That's what prevents him from being a Top 3-5 corner. I'm pointing out with those statistics how reputation & perception becomes reality for some fans. But, perception is often wrong. Some fans don't understand the game and judge based on limited knowledge. That leads to over reactions about certain players--Hall being one.


I agree with you that Hall's reputation lends to folks knocking him as a corner. I admit that I sometimes get caught up in that, but then I say, "DeAngelo is DeAngelo" which means, you take the good and the bad. I also forget that he is not that old, so he can bounce back and have a better year next year just like other players who don't have their usual year. The CB FA market is weak this year. To me Grimes is the only one worth considering, but given his injury and the way Hall keeps bouncing back from adversity, I would say that he will be back next year. Even if we draft a CB in the higher rounds, with the rookie wage scale we can afford to keep Hall while the rookie develops. I think the Gronk play did bother Hall, he knows it at the very least made him look bad, so I think we will see the best of Hall these last two games like we saw last week.

Thanks for posting the stats. I totally get your point.


+1
SPIT HAPPENS!!
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Postby Red_One43 » Sat Dec 31, 2011 10:58 pm

DeAngelo assesses how he played this season:

“I feel like, for the most part, I played pretty solid this year,” Hall said. “Last year, I made more plays but I gave up more plays, too. I wouldn’t say this year I’ve made a ton of plays one way or the other.”


http://www.realredskins.com/rich-tandle ... of-it.html

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Postby Red_One43 » Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:11 pm

The Hogster wrote:Revis Whiffing on Tebow. I wonder if their fans want to cut him after he's Tarred & Feathered.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlgMvml3v8o


This video shows Asomugha whiffing on Victor Cruz (Not the first horrible missed tackle but the one where Asomugha ducks his head in a feable lack of an attempt to tackle).

Watching the videos of the poor efforts of Revis and Asomugha, make want to cut Hall a little slack. No excuses for him, but more slack. Here's to Raheim Morris teaching Hall to elevate his cover game and putting him in the right places.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Pla ... blitz.html

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Postby cowboykillerzRGiii » Wed Jul 18, 2012 12:01 am

Yall are bringing threads back from the dead laitly!
I am a hall supporter but this year w Morris he needs to REALLY step it up.. especially if its HIS Defence.
#21 forever in our hearts
...and yet ANOTHER record setting performance by "RG3 the third"!!!!
“I wanted to just… put his lights out ….because, you know, …Dallas sucks…” - Dexter Manley

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Postby Red_One43 » Wed Jul 18, 2012 12:07 am

cowboykillerzRED wrote:Yall are bringing threads back from the dead laitly!
I am a hall supporter but this year w Morris he needs to REALLY step it up.. especially if its HIS Defence.


Signs of boredom during the offseason :lol:

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Postby the poster » Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:57 pm

Red_One43 wrote:[
Watching the videos of the poor efforts of Revis and Asomugha, make want to cut Hall a little slack. No excuses for him, but more slack.


no excuses but cut him slack. uh huh. u saw a pair of videos on the internet showing two football plays from last season and this provides either initial or further evidence to then think about an UNRELATED player (Hall) and think to yourself...."yeah, those other guys sucked on those two plays....I think Hall deserves more slack. Not making excuses for him, but he deserves more slack"

when did core redskin fans turn into this mealy mouthed, passive enablers.

let me comment on Hall CORRECTLY and succintly.

He sucks. He gets paid a lot of money for as bad as he is. He needs to stop being the weak link on their defense if they are expecting to improve defensively and no video of some OTHER player is going to change that.

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Postby cowboykillerzRGiii » Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:36 am

Like the tampon that gets flushed... It's already THAT time of the month.... I guess Adam Scott groupies are hurt, I understand. Carry on :invite to smack:
#21 forever in our hearts
...and yet ANOTHER record setting performance by "RG3 the third"!!!!
“I wanted to just… put his lights out ….because, you know, …Dallas sucks…” - Dexter Manley

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