The Trouble with RG3

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The Trouble with RG3

Postby Chris Luva Luva » Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:53 pm

http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/06/robert-griffin-washington-redskins-pocket-passer/

Every great NFL quarterback (with the possible exception of Ben Roethlisberger) has a refined pocket presence. Griffin, at this point, does not.

This should be alarming to Washington, because it factors into the amount (and severity) of hits RG3 takes.



A lot of the points brought up in this article have been mentioned by quite a few folks on the board. It's always interesting seeing such analysis because it explains a lot of what we see and gives meaning to it. We're so quick to blame the offensive line when RGIII is being pummeled and are stuck :hmm: when Shanahan praises the line... Well, this is a good indication why.
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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby frankcal20 » Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:00 pm

RG3 this season has missed open receivers and for some either didn't see them or chose to go elsewhere. RG3 last week showed a bit more grit in my opinion. Something we saw last year. Almost playing angry. Didn't look to get hit but looked to avoid hits. What was also nice to see is he got rid of the ball when the play wasn't there and threw the ball away. Something he didn't do vs Denver. It was like he just wouldn't give up on a play and would force it.

It's so easy to forget though that RG3 is only in his 2nd season and while guys like Luck look amazing, Luck isn't coming off an injury and more importantly isn't asked to do as much as RG given they have a more talented roster IMO. Their defense helps them out a lot.

RG3 does need to avoid hits since he's not built like a RB but I do think it's important for him to try to make plays when they are there to be made and move on to the next play if there's nothing there. Sometimes the Defense just has the right call and the offensive play isn't going to work. Don't forget, the defense is making a paycheck too.

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby SkinsJock » Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:34 pm

.. Halfway through his second season, it’s impossible to call Robert Griffin III anything but an unrefined quarterback. Slowed by his surgically repaired right knee and often playing from behind, he’s learning how to be a drop-back passer the hard way


this is his opinion - RG3 is a 2nd year QB and the 'plan' this season is to make some changes to the way he plays in order to minimize the hits from the way he played last season - this is an ongoing process and RG3 is playing better despite not having a very good pass blocking O line

I think the implication that RG3 is "slowed" by the injury is incorrect - he's indicated that he is not hampered by the brace or by effects from the injury … I think he knows more about his legs and his physical capabilities than this reporter does

RG3 is trying his best to make Kyle's offense work the way that Kyle wants it run - last season they wanted to use plays that he was familiar with and this season they are putting in a slightly different offense

RG3 is a work in progress but he's incredibly bright and very motivated - he'll figure this out

RG3 is a lot better QB at this time than this reporter is implying
Griffin can become a really good QB but it's going to take time

We are lucky to have Cousins - hopefully he can continue to play well

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby riggofan » Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:44 pm

frankcal20 wrote:It's so easy to forget though that RG3 is only in his 2nd season and while guys like Luck look amazing, Luck isn't coming off an injury and more importantly isn't asked to do as much as RG given they have a more talented roster IMO. Their defense helps them out a lot.


The Colts aren't in year two of a huge salary cap penalty. :)

I'm not discounting the criticism of RGIII as a pocket passer, coming from people much more knowledgeable than I will ever be. I just think its probably early to make too many judgements about how good he can be. The guy seems very intelligent on top of his incredible athleticism, so I tend to believe he will improve. And like frankcal pointed out, adding more talent around him over the next year or two should be a big help.

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby Kilmer72 » Thu Nov 07, 2013 5:21 pm

Chris Luva Luva wrote:http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/06/robert-griffin-washington-redskins-pocket-passer/

Every great NFL quarterback (with the possible exception of Ben Roethlisberger) has a refined pocket presence. Griffin, at this point, does not.

This should be alarming to Washington, because it factors into the amount (and severity) of hits RG3 takes.



A lot of the points brought up in this article have been mentioned by quite a few folks on the board. It's always interesting seeing such analysis because it explains a lot of what we see and gives meaning to it. We're so quick to blame the offensive line when RGIII is being pummeled and are stuck :hmm: when Shanahan praises the line... Well, this is a good indication why.


I agree with what you quoted out of that article. The problem is how long would they "Every great NFL quarterback" last behind our offensive pass protection? How great would they look? The amount of hits Robert takes behind the line would lesson if they could block the rush better.

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby SkinsJock » Thu Nov 07, 2013 5:27 pm

riggofan wrote:
frankcal20 wrote:It's so easy to forget though that RG3 is only in his 2nd season and while guys like Luck look amazing, Luck isn't coming off an injury and more importantly isn't asked to do as much as RG given they have a more talented roster IMO. Their defense helps them out a lot.


The Colts aren't in year two of a huge salary cap penalty. :)

I'm not discounting the criticism of RGIII as a pocket passer, coming from people much more knowledgeable than I will ever be. I just think its probably early to make too many judgements about how good he can be. The guy seems very intelligent on top of his incredible athleticism, so I tend to believe he will improve. And like frankcal pointed out, adding more talent around him over the next year or two should be a big help.


+1 - RG3 definitely has some work to do - to imply that he's not making progress or that he does not look all that promising is a little premature IMO

there are a number of reasons to be excited about RG3 and there are a number of things that he needs to work on

let's not be too hasty to downgrade this kid
Griffin can become a really good QB but it's going to take time

We are lucky to have Cousins - hopefully he can continue to play well

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby Countertrey » Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:18 pm

Here's the deal... Luck was in a pro-style system. He is a very intelligent player who arrived with a pretty full set of pocket skills.
Bob comes from a spread offense, where he was asked to use his athleticism to extend pass plays, and to contribute to the running game. He was never asked to work from a pocket. Now, Bob is also a pretty darned intelligent young man. He has been asked to learn pocket passing skills ON THE FLY... DURING THE SEASON. We are seeing growing pains, not because of his lack of skills... but because HE IS COMMITTED to develop new skills. He persists in the pocket, even when his comfort level is low, because of his discipline, and his understanding that this is important to his development, and it is what his coaches are asking him to do. OF COURSE, Luck is ahead in this area. He had a HUGE head start in the pocket game. The comparison is dumb. Bob, in fact DOES have a fairly strong pocket awareness... to see a QB with a true lack of pocket awareness, see Jason Campbell in B&G. Bob has, on occasion, been unaware of the doom approaching from behind... but, usually, he get's rid of the ball... and, lessons have been learned from early season disasters. Campbell, I recall, almost NEVER sensed the dark presence approaching...
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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby Kilmer72 » Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:35 pm

Countertrey wrote:Here's the deal... Luck was in a pro-style system. He is a very intelligent player who arrived with a pretty full set of pocket skills.
Bob comes from a spread offense, where he was asked to use his athleticism to extend pass plays, and to contribute to the running game. He was never asked to work from a pocket. Now, Bob is also a pretty darned intelligent young man. He has been asked to learn pocket passing skills ON THE FLY... DURING THE SEASON. We are seeing growing pains, not because of his lack of skills... but because HE IS COMMITTED to develop new skills. He persists in the pocket, even when his comfort level is low, because of his discipline, and his understanding that this is important to his development, and it is what his coaches are asking him to do. OF COURSE, Luck is ahead in this area. He had a HUGE head start in the pocket game. The comparison is dumb. Bob, in fact DOES have a fairly strong pocket awareness... to see a QB with a true lack of pocket awareness, see Jason Campbell in B&G. Bob has, on occasion, been unaware of the doom approaching from behind... but, usually, he get's rid of the ball... and, lessons have been learned from early season disasters. Campbell, I recall, almost NEVER sensed the dark presence approaching...


EXACTLY!!!

These sports writers and ex QBs fail to remember that he was never expected to look more polished than Luck. Like you also said, Robert has on occasion been unaware. I also think a lot of blame should go to pass protection as well.

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby SkinsJock » Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:55 pm

the pass protection was terrible in the game tonight … If Mike is intimating that this O line is OK, he's wrong

Robert Griffin III was amazing considering the non existent protection and Kyle's stupid play calling

we are very fortunate to have a QB like this that we can build our offense around

and

as we have seen … there's some work to do
Griffin can become a really good QB but it's going to take time

We are lucky to have Cousins - hopefully he can continue to play well

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby StorminMormon86 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:16 am

SkinsJock wrote:the pass protection was terrible in the game tonight … If Mike is intimating that this O line is OK, he's wrong

Robert Griffin III was amazing considering the non existent protection and Kyle's stupid play calling

we are very fortunate to have a QB like this that we can build our offense around

and

as we have seen … there's some work to do

Pass protection was good in the first half. And Kyle called a decent game, IMO. We need to give credit to the Vikings D.

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby Chris Luva Luva » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:23 am

SkinsJock wrote:we are very fortunate to have a QB like this that we can build our offense around


I'm sorry but I can't call his play-calling stupid when the receivers are open and Robert sail the pass over their head. Roberts accuracy was off and has been off for quite a while. Not say Kyle is infallible, he's far from it. But every article, this one included is saying that the receivers are WIDE OPEN, but Robert can't find them. That's NOT Kyles fault. The plays are working as designed, Robert has to grow into being a proper drop-back QB.
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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby StorminMormon86 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:38 am

The play calling in last night's game was 37 pass to 36 rush calls. That's balanced. Kyle did not call a bad game. And we need to stop blaming our offensive line every freakin' time we lose a game. The Vikings D deserves some credit. Our line played good in the first half, sucked against the blitz, but I still think they were giving Griffin a decent amount of time. He was making awesome throws under pressure in the first half while he was getting hit, and then missing guys in the 2nd. It's like a switch was turned off that shut our offense down in the 2nd half.

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby SkinsJock » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:53 am

Chris Luva Luva wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:we are very fortunate to have a QB like this that we can build our offense around


I'm sorry but I can't call his play-calling stupid when the receivers are open and Robert sail the pass over their head. Roberts accuracy was off and has been off for quite a while. Not say Kyle is infallible, he's far from it. But every article, this one included is saying that the receivers are WIDE OPEN, but Robert can't find them. That's NOT Kyles fault. The plays are working as designed, Robert has to grow into being a proper drop-back QB.


I agree that Robert's got a lot of work to do and that there have been a number of 'open' players that he's missed …

I think he'll continue to improve in this offense - IMO - he's better each game

I don't think that Kyle's game planning and play calling are in sync with Robert's adapting from what he did last season

I don't think that we're seeing much from Kyle - I think he's a good play caller but I don't think he's good enough - that's probably just me :lol:
Griffin can become a really good QB but it's going to take time

We are lucky to have Cousins - hopefully he can continue to play well

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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby Countertrey » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:56 am

Chris Luva Luva wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:we are very fortunate to have a QB like this that we can build our offense around


I'm sorry but I can't call his play-calling stupid when the receivers are open and Robert sail the pass over their head. Roberts accuracy was off and has been off for quite a while. Not say Kyle is infallible, he's far from it. But every article, this one included is saying that the receivers are WIDE OPEN, but Robert can't find them. That's NOT Kyles fault. The plays are working as designed, Robert has to grow into being a proper drop-back QB.

Umm... Chris... Bob was pretty damned accurate last night... you sure you weren't watching a replay of the Philly game? I saw THREE passes last night that really missed the target... and one of them may have been deliberate due to good coverage and a lousy angle. Bob did fine last night... and he did fine last week.

I also think that Kyle called a very nice game last night. He (and Bob) were let down by that sieve known as the Redskins O-line.

Sorry... the only one that has any business in pass pro is Trent.
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Re: The Trouble with RG3

Postby StorminMormon86 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:56 am

Last year - "Griffin is awesome! He single handedly saved our team and our offense!"
This year - "Kyle's play calling sucks! Fire him!"

Funny how no one mentioned Kyle's play calling last year being good when we went on our 7 game win streak. But when we lose? Man oh man.

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