This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Talk about the Washington Redskins here. Do you bleed burgundy and gold?
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby riggofan » Thu May 29, 2014 3:08 pm

Deadskins wrote:Do you understand the point I am making now?


I understand that you're dodging the question. Moving on... :)

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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby hanburgerheel » Thu May 29, 2014 3:29 pm

And, this notion of "Why can't you address living American Indians as Redskins?" is also wrong. Redskins are a fantasy, or at best an imaginary amalgam when in the context of a team mascot. Unless you have people dressing up as a character-version of them, they are never "real" in a tangible sense. Even then, when someone is dressed-up as any mascot and running around on the sidelines, those are caricatures and embellishments that are also not intended to offend. An argument could be made that anytime a Pirate mascot is allowed in sports, it is automatically advocating for Piracy to flourish in a society and for the actions of Pirates throughout history to be more accepted and praised.

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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby Deadskins » Thu May 29, 2014 3:36 pm

riggofan wrote:
Deadskins wrote:Do you understand the point I am making now?


I understand that you're dodging the question. Moving on... :)

And I understand why you keep saying I'm dodging the question, even though I've answered it several times. You're not getting the answer you're trying so desperately to elicit. :wink:

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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby cowboykillerzRGiii » Thu May 29, 2014 11:53 pm

Daaaaamn...
I feel like we are gettin as bad as the gov sho signed this crap... is this all there is to talk about?? Surely coach mentioned more then just Tanard after ota... how's RGiii s footwork looking?

Not talkin crap jus sayin this argument is dumb and is a good way to fill the air, nothing more.

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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby cowboykillerzRGiii » Fri May 30, 2014 12:47 am

BREAKING NEWS!!!!

ROBERT HAS GROWN A BEARD!!!!
-Kind of.
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby Irn-Bru » Fri May 30, 2014 8:02 am

Deadskins wrote:I'm not dodging anything, but I am explaining, because you're not getting my point. I keep trying to explain to you why Dan, Roger, I, you, or anyone else wouldn't walk up to some Indian they don't know and say "Hello Redskin." It's asinine! Would you walk up to a white person and say "Hello White?" Or a black person and say "Hello Black?" I doubt it. You wouldn't even walk up to an Indian and say "Hello Indian." It's got nothing to do with how flowery you say it. The person receiving the greeting has no context for the usage, other than racism. But that doesn't make the word Redskin inherently racist, nor does it mean that the word can't be used to honor Indian heritage when used in a respectful way. Do you understand the point I am making now?


Yes. This is the same point I was trying to make, but I don't seem to have gotten the message through either. :|
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby emoses14 » Fri May 30, 2014 8:57 am

I simply can't resist: Word usage and context matters, nothing is ever said in a vacuum. There is an entire manner of speaking, word choice and inflection I use with my kids; with my wife; with my boys; with my co-workers; with my bosses. Words I'd use in one setting I wouldn't dare in another, in part due in/appropriateness, but also because context matters. I feel like this isn't a difficult concept.

For what it's worth, a growing part of me (still small, though) fears that the message sent by caving to these demands and changing the name right now (maybe ever), sends a far more troubling message than not changing. Either way, I very much fear that people bring to bear on this situation their feelings at large about tangentially related topics (tyranny of the minority, privilege of the privileged, racism, etc.), without appreciating the unique nature of this question. For example, trying to make this "debate" about racismISM (that is, the codified, institutionalized form of oppression based on race) is setting up a strawman aimed to do what strawmen do, set the parameters of the conversation to fit one view.
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby langleyparkjoe » Fri May 30, 2014 11:38 am

.. but how are they going to stop ME from saying "Redskins" is the question I'd like answered. lol
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby DarthMonk » Fri May 30, 2014 12:09 pm

langleyparkjoe wrote:.. but how are they going to stop ME from saying "Redskins" is the question I'd like answered. lol


Room 101, pal.

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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby riggofan » Fri May 30, 2014 1:06 pm

Irn-Bru wrote:
Deadskins wrote:I'm not dodging anything, but I am explaining, because you're not getting my point. I keep trying to explain to you why Dan, Roger, I, you, or anyone else wouldn't walk up to some Indian they don't know and say "Hello Redskin." It's asinine! Would you walk up to a white person and say "Hello White?" Or a black person and say "Hello Black?" I doubt it. You wouldn't even walk up to an Indian and say "Hello Indian." It's got nothing to do with how flowery you say it. The person receiving the greeting has no context for the usage, other than racism. But that doesn't make the word Redskin inherently racist, nor does it mean that the word can't be used to honor Indian heritage when used in a respectful way. Do you understand the point I am making now?


Yes. This is the same point I was trying to make, but I don't seem to have gotten the message through either. :|


No worries fellas. I get your message clearly. But you're just offering explanations for why you wouldn't normally do these things. That's not at all the question. This was basically a dare posed to Goodell. I'm not arguing whether or not its asinine to do this in everyday life.

I understand I wouldn't normally walk up to a person and say, "Hello, White Man." But if somebody said, prove to me that "White Man" is not an offensive slur, by walking up to the next caucasian on the street and saying "Hello, White Man" then I could do it.

Ok now I'm moving on for real. :)

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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby yupchagee » Fri May 30, 2014 2:10 pm

Einstein said "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler". Keeping things simple, Polls show that 90% of Native Americans are fine with Redskins.

Why Change?
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby Deadskins » Fri May 30, 2014 8:36 pm

yupchagee wrote:Einstein said "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler". Keeping things simple, Polls show that 90% of Native Americans are fine with Redskins.

Why Change?

I think it's pretty funny that a higher percentage of Indians are fine with the Redskins name than the percentage of the general public.
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby Deadskins » Fri May 30, 2014 8:40 pm

riggofan wrote:I understand I wouldn't normally walk up to a person and say, "Hello, White Man." But if somebody said, prove to me that "White Man" is not an offensive slur, by walking up to the next caucasian on the street and saying "Hello, White Man" then I could do it.

Probably so, but I doubt you would say the same thing if you substituted Black for White in that scenario. Does that make Black an offensive slur?
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby DarthMonk » Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:11 pm

Deadskins wrote:
riggofan wrote:I understand I wouldn't normally walk up to a person and say, "Hello, White Man." But if somebody said, prove to me that "White Man" is not an offensive slur, by walking up to the next caucasian on the street and saying "Hello, White Man" then I could do it.

Probably so, but I doubt you would say the same thing if you substituted Black for White in that scenario. Does that make Black an offensive slur?


From the sidelines I would say no ... That does not make black an offensive slur. On the other hand riggofan's original post along this line of reasoning suggested more the converse ... that were there no negative reaction that would prove the word in question is not an offensive slur.
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Re: This is a pretty amazing article about the name Redskins

Postby yupchagee » Sun Jun 01, 2014 6:16 pm

Deadskins wrote:
yupchagee wrote:Einstein said "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler". Keeping things simple, Polls show that 90% of Native Americans are fine with Redskins.

Why Change?

I think it's pretty funny that a higher percentage of Indians are fine with the Redskins name than the percentage of the general public.


So do I.
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