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SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Joined: 27 Dec 2005
Posts: 4884
Location: Surfside
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| Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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Interestingly, Calais Campbell has fallen out of Mike Mayocks top 5 DE's. He was replaced by Dre Moore, DT out of Maryland. Moore is also listed at #5 on the top 5 DT's list.
I wonder if his placement on the DE list is a mistake or if Mayock thinks he can play both positions. I've heard Mayock speak highly of Moore recently, but I didn't hear him mention anything about the potential of Moore playing DE. |
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CanesSkins26
Canes Skin
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 6870
Location: Alexandria, VA
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| Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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| SkinsFreak wrote: | Interestingly, Calais Campbell has fallen out of Mike Mayocks top 5 DE's. He was replaced by Dre Moore, DT out of Maryland. Moore is also listed at #5 on the top 5 DT's list.
I wonder if his placement on the DE list is a mistake or if Mayock thinks he can play both positions. I've heard Mayock speak highly of Moore recently, but I didn't hear him mention anything about the potential of Moore playing DE. |
I think that has to be a mistake. Moore weighs around 310 pounds. I can't imagine him being a very effective defensive end at that size. |
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andyjens89
Hog
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
Posts: 1894
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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Mike Mayock hahahahahahahahaha
Who cares what he thinks??? He has McFadden ranked as the 16th best player in the draft!!! |
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SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Joined: 27 Dec 2005
Posts: 4884
Location: Surfside
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 8:45 am Post subject: |
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| andyjens89 wrote: | Mike Mayock hahahahahahahahaha
Who cares what he thinks??? He has McFadden ranked as the 16th best player in the draft!!! |
Just because you and Mayock differ on the ranking of McFadden means Mayock doesn't know anything? Mayock is one of the best in the business and has extensive experience analyzing college players. He readily admits McFadden will most likely be a top ten pick, as several teams are looking for RB's in the draft, but he specifically rates the players and isn't factoring team needs.
| Quote: | Mayock was consistently more interesting than ESPN's draft maven, Mel Kiper Jr. Kiper is well informed, but Mayock interprets and explains better, perhaps because he was a player and has been in the broadcast booth.
What the NFL Network showed, in a side-by-side analysis of how it and ESPN covered the first 10 picks, is that less can be more. ESPN's formula — of more, more, more, from everywhere possible — needs tweaking. It bounced from its Radio City Music Hall set to Bristol to the "Cold Pizza" set, but could not outshine the surprisingly nimble NFL Network.
At Radio City, ESPN had Berman, Tom Jackson, Michael Irvin, Chris Mortensen and Kiper (with Steve Young chiming in by satellite), but this is an overwhelmingly pro football panel, not a college group. They can offer an N.F.L. perspective — if you can stomach Berman's weak attempts at humor and Irvin's refusal to speak in any tone less than a nearly incomprehensible shout.
Only Kiper is as knowledgeable about what these players did in college as Kirk Herbstreit, Lee Corso and Chris Fowler of ESPN's "College GameDay" program. |
Dre Moore
6'4 - 305 lbs - 4.86 (A 4.86 is pretty darn quick for a guy that size.)
| Quote: | Strengths:
Terrific size with a big frame...Excellent strength...Great speed and quickness with a burst to close...Plays with a nasty demeanor...Has good range and makes plays in pursuit...Can penetrate and wreak havoc in the backfield...Has the potential to be stout at the point of attack...Could play in multiple schemes...Has some upside.
Weaknesses:
Still pretty raw...Lackluster instincts and awareness...Inconsistent leverage...Does not use his hands well...Pass rush repertoire is limited...He doesn't play up to his weight room numbers..His work ethic and motor have been brought into question.
Notes:
First name is actually Marchondray...He played just one year of varsity football in high school..Could project to either a 4-3 or 3-4 scheme...Has everything you look for physically but just has not been able to put it all together yet, although he did have his best year as a senior...A "Workout Warrior" who will probably be chosen earlier than his film would otherwise indicate...Quite possibly a boom or bust type. |
Dre Moore picks off Matt Ryan
| Quote: | | Dre Moore (Defensive Tackle, Maryland) A big, somewhat soft-looking tackle but a natural athlete who carries his weight well and shows first step quickness, Moore is a natural bender who fires out of his stance. And at 6-foot-4 and 311 lbs., he posted a very impressive 4.88 forty time. |
I also agree the #5 ranking at defensive end is most likely a mistake, but Moore 'could' be an awfully good pick-up for someone. |
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PulpExposure
Pushing Paper
Joined: 06 Sep 2005
Posts: 4461
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 9:21 am Post subject: |
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| SkinsFreak wrote: | | I also agree the #5 ranking at defensive end is most likely a mistake, but Moore 'could' be an awfully good pick-up for someone. |
I watched Dre Moore at Maryland, and imho he's overrated. He looks like a star DT, puts up great workout numbers, but never really played that way. He was very, very, inconsistent, and his effort was really questionable. |
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SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Joined: 27 Dec 2005
Posts: 4884
Location: Surfside
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| PulpExposure wrote: | | SkinsFreak wrote: | | I also agree the #5 ranking at defensive end is most likely a mistake, but Moore 'could' be an awfully good pick-up for someone. |
I watched Dre Moore at Maryland, and imho he's overrated. He looks like a star DT, puts up great workout numbers, but never really played that way. He was very, very, inconsistent, and his effort was really questionable. |
I'm a Maryland alum and watch them as well. I agree he never really stood out and I never really paid much attention to him. I know he has the "boom or bust" tag placed on him. |
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yupchagee
#14
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 4110
Location: Louisville KY
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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| SkinsFreak wrote: | | PulpExposure wrote: | | SkinsFreak wrote: | | I also agree the #5 ranking at defensive end is most likely a mistake, but Moore 'could' be an awfully good pick-up for someone. |
I watched Dre Moore at Maryland, and imho he's overrated. He looks like a star DT, puts up great workout numbers, but never really played that way. He was very, very, inconsistent, and his effort was really questionable. |
I'm a Maryland alum and watch them as well. I agree he never really stood out and I never really paid much attention to him. I know he has the "boom or bust" tag placed on him. |
He recorded 6 sacks last yr. That led his team. That's very good for a DT.
Some describe him as a work in progress, which should nean a lot of upside. I wouldn't pick him in the 1st rnd, but if he slips to the 3rd I might. |
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SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Joined: 27 Dec 2005
Posts: 4884
Location: Surfside
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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| yupchagee wrote: | He recorded 6 sacks last yr. That led his team. That's very good for a DT.
Some describe him as a work in progress, which should nean a lot of upside. I wouldn't pick him in the 1st rnd, but if he slips to the 3rd I might. |
I think you're right. Some say he got a late start but has progressed every year. I don't subscribe to a college football package, so I'm not able to get all of the Terps games here in South Florida.
| Quote: | Moore is a bit of an enigma. Blessed with a rare combination of size, strength and straight-line speed, he has the physical tools to develop into an upper echelon defensive tackle. However, Moore has struggled throughout his career with an inconsistent motor and a lack of instincts.
Optimists would point out that he signed with Maryland after playing only two seasons of high school football and improved his play each of his years with the Terps. Pessimists, meanwhile, question why Moore hasn't already become a better player. He has flashed the quickness off the snap to generate big plays throughout his career and has excellent upper body strength to hold up against the double-team.
What isn't up for debate is Moore's talent and rise in production. A starter in 10 of 13 games in 2006, Moore registered 47 tackles, including 7.5 tackles for loss and 3.5 sacks. His numbers improved to 63 tackles, 8.5 tackles for loss and a team-leading 6.0 sacks as a senior. |
Many, many experts thought Alan Branch was a sure thing is last years draft. The Cardinals moved up to grab him in the 1st round. In 11 games last year, Branch only had 8 tackles and no sacks. I know it's speculating, but I gotta think Moore would be more productive than that. |
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CanesSkins26
Canes Skin
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 6870
Location: Alexandria, VA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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Many, many experts thought Alan Branch was a sure thing is last years draft. The Cardinals moved up to grab him in the 1st round. In 11 games last year, Branch only had 8 tackles and no sacks. I know it's speculating, but I gotta think Moore would be more productive than that. |
Branch wasn't selected in the first round. He was taken in the second round by the Cards. Comparing Moore to Branch is pretty interesting though. I came across this when I was looking up some info on Moore...
| Quote: | | Dre Moore, Maryland. Moore is similar in his talent level and on-field production to former Michigan defensive tackle Alan Branch, whom the Cardinals drafted in the second round last year. Although Moore has the strength and athleticism that few 320-plus pound defensive tackles have, he did not play with the aggressiveness or passion to be consistently productive. He must show up at the Combine in good shape and must work out well to ease concerns that he will be the same player as Branch. With a bad Combine, Moore could slide to the fourth round, but with his size, strength and natural athleticism, if he is in shape and works out at a high level (which all sigs point to him doing), then he can put himself into position to be a late first-round or early second-round pick. Moore could end up as the fastest prospect at his position, running the 40 in the 4.8-second range, which would be amazing considering his size. |
http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=356026
Moore does seem like an interesting prospect. I don't think that he would be a bad pick in 2nd round if we draft a receiver in the first. |
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CanesSkins26
Canes Skin
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 6870
Location: Alexandria, VA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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Even though I do think that we should take a receiver in the first, if none of the guys that we want are available, I think that the team needs to take a long look at Kentwan Balmer. He has a lot of upside and could be disruptive force that we need in the middle of our dline.
| Quote: | 3. Kentwan Balmer, North Carolina, 6-5, 308: If he can play consistently near his potential and stay focused, Balmer has the potential to become an impact player.
He has a disruptive initial explosion and a powerful upper body and rip move that sustain his pressure. His versatility was displayed when he started at right end (three times), left tackle (eight) and right tackle (12) during his college career.
According to coaches, on 55 plays in which Balmer had run responsibility last season, the opposition was held to 93 total yards (1.69 yards an attempt and 7.75 yards a game).
His career totals are 93 tackles (55 solos) with seven sacks for minus 52 yards, 17 stops for losses of 79 yards and 10 quarterback pressures. He also blocked two extra points against archrival Duke in 2006. |
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2008-03-06-sw-defensive-linemen_N.htm
| Quote: | | 6. Kentwan Balmer, North Carolina, DT: A big, athletic interior player with outstanding physical tools. Balmer shed his underachiever label with a breakout senior season and established himself as one of the top defensive tackles in the draft. At 6-foot-4, 308 pounds, Balmer possesses the size and athleticism that scouts covet in an inside player. Though his inconsistent career production is a concern, most scouts rated Balmer's upside off the charts. With few quality defensive tackles available, expect a team to grab Balmer in the middle of the first round. |
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/bucky_brooks/02/19/defensiveline.draft/
| Quote: | North Carolina defensive tackle Kentwan Balmer developed into a college star last fall only after a new coaching staff helped him realize his potential.
"It's always been a dream of mine to be a first-round pick," Balmer said. "Everybody always said I had the athletic ability to do it, but there's more to being a first-round pick than athletic ability. You have to be a complete player. You have to be able to study film, watch what you eat and get proper rest. I think earlier in my career, I didn't understand how to do it."
That all changed when defensive line coach John Blake arrived in Chapel Hill after the 2006 season. Blake, who won two Super Bowl rings as a Dallas Cowboys assistant in the 1990s, altered Balmer's work habits on and off the field.
Balmer learned how to break down an opponent and study game film in such a way that he could discover an opponent's tendencies. That strategy worked wonders in a 16-13 victory over Maryland last year. He knew when the Terrapins were running a power play by the way the guard positioned himself, and he recorded a sack by breaking down Maryland's snap count.
After recording only 16 tackles and 2.5 tackles for loss as a junior, Balmer had 59 tackles and 9.5 tackles for loss as a senior. Coyle rates Balmer as the No. 23 prospect in this class and has him going 26th to the Jacksonville Jaguars in his mock draft.
Balmer believes his draft stock wouldn't have soared to such heights if Blake hadn't become a part of his life. "Without him, I probably wouldn't be standing in front of you right now," Balmer said. |
http://nfldraft.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=778857 |
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yupchagee
#14
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 4110
Location: Louisville KY
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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| CanesSkins26 wrote: | Even though I do think that we should take a receiver in the first, if none of the guys that we want are available, I think that the team needs to take a long look at Kentwan Balmer. He has a lot of upside and could be disruptive force that we need in the middle of our dline.
| Quote: | 3. Kentwan Balmer, North Carolina, 6-5, 308: If he can play consistently near his potential and stay focused, Balmer has the potential to become an impact player.
He has a disruptive initial explosion and a powerful upper body and rip move that sustain his pressure. His versatility was displayed when he started at right end (three times), left tackle (eight) and right tackle (12) during his college career.
According to coaches, on 55 plays in which Balmer had run responsibility last season, the opposition was held to 93 total yards (1.69 yards an attempt and 7.75 yards a game).
His career totals are 93 tackles (55 solos) with seven sacks for minus 52 yards, 17 stops for losses of 79 yards and 10 quarterback pressures. He also blocked two extra points against archrival Duke in 2006. |
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2008-03-06-sw-defensive-linemen_N.htm
| Quote: | | 6. Kentwan Balmer, North Carolina, DT: A big, athletic interior player with outstanding physical tools. Balmer shed his underachiever label with a breakout senior season and established himself as one of the top defensive tackles in the draft. At 6-foot-4, 308 pounds, Balmer possesses the size and athleticism that scouts covet in an inside player. Though his inconsistent career production is a concern, most scouts rated Balmer's upside off the charts. With few quality defensive tackles available, expect a team to grab Balmer in the middle of the first round. |
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/bucky_brooks/02/19/defensiveline.draft/
| Quote: | North Carolina defensive tackle Kentwan Balmer developed into a college star last fall only after a new coaching staff helped him realize his potential.
"It's always been a dream of mine to be a first-round pick," Balmer said. "Everybody always said I had the athletic ability to do it, but there's more to being a first-round pick than athletic ability. You have to be a complete player. You have to be able to study film, watch what you eat and get proper rest. I think earlier in my career, I didn't understand how to do it."
That all changed when defensive line coach John Blake arrived in Chapel Hill after the 2006 season. Blake, who won two Super Bowl rings as a Dallas Cowboys assistant in the 1990s, altered Balmer's work habits on and off the field.
Balmer learned how to break down an opponent and study game film in such a way that he could discover an opponent's tendencies. That strategy worked wonders in a 16-13 victory over Maryland last year. He knew when the Terrapins were running a power play by the way the guard positioned himself, and he recorded a sack by breaking down Maryland's snap count.
After recording only 16 tackles and 2.5 tackles for loss as a junior, Balmer had 59 tackles and 9.5 tackles for loss as a senior. Coyle rates Balmer as the No. 23 prospect in this class and has him going 26th to the Jacksonville Jaguars in his mock draft.
Balmer believes his draft stock wouldn't have soared to such heights if Blake hadn't become a part of his life. "Without him, I probably wouldn't be standing in front of you right now," Balmer said. |
http://nfldraft.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=778857 |
I thought we were looking for a good pass rusher. Balmer's record does not indicate that he is that player. |
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CanesSkins26
Canes Skin
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 6870
Location: Alexandria, VA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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| yupchagee wrote: | | CanesSkins26 wrote: | Even though I do think that we should take a receiver in the first, if none of the guys that we want are available, I think that the team needs to take a long look at Kentwan Balmer. He has a lot of upside and could be disruptive force that we need in the middle of our dline.
| Quote: | 3. Kentwan Balmer, North Carolina, 6-5, 308: If he can play consistently near his potential and stay focused, Balmer has the potential to become an impact player.
He has a disruptive initial explosion and a powerful upper body and rip move that sustain his pressure. His versatility was displayed when he started at right end (three times), left tackle (eight) and right tackle (12) during his college career.
According to coaches, on 55 plays in which Balmer had run responsibility last season, the opposition was held to 93 total yards (1.69 yards an attempt and 7.75 yards a game).
His career totals are 93 tackles (55 solos) with seven sacks for minus 52 yards, 17 stops for losses of 79 yards and 10 quarterback pressures. He also blocked two extra points against archrival Duke in 2006. |
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2008-03-06-sw-defensive-linemen_N.htm
| Quote: | | 6. Kentwan Balmer, North Carolina, DT: A big, athletic interior player with outstanding physical tools. Balmer shed his underachiever label with a breakout senior season and established himself as one of the top defensive tackles in the draft. At 6-foot-4, 308 pounds, Balmer possesses the size and athleticism that scouts covet in an inside player. Though his inconsistent career production is a concern, most scouts rated Balmer's upside off the charts. With few quality defensive tackles available, expect a team to grab Balmer in the middle of the first round. |
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/bucky_brooks/02/19/defensiveline.draft/
| Quote: | North Carolina defensive tackle Kentwan Balmer developed into a college star last fall only after a new coaching staff helped him realize his potential.
"It's always been a dream of mine to be a first-round pick," Balmer said. "Everybody always said I had the athletic ability to do it, but there's more to being a first-round pick than athletic ability. You have to be a complete player. You have to be able to study film, watch what you eat and get proper rest. I think earlier in my career, I didn't understand how to do it."
That all changed when defensive line coach John Blake arrived in Chapel Hill after the 2006 season. Blake, who won two Super Bowl rings as a Dallas Cowboys assistant in the 1990s, altered Balmer's work habits on and off the field.
Balmer learned how to break down an opponent and study game film in such a way that he could discover an opponent's tendencies. That strategy worked wonders in a 16-13 victory over Maryland last year. He knew when the Terrapins were running a power play by the way the guard positioned himself, and he recorded a sack by breaking down Maryland's snap count.
After recording only 16 tackles and 2.5 tackles for loss as a junior, Balmer had 59 tackles and 9.5 tackles for loss as a senior. Coyle rates Balmer as the No. 23 prospect in this class and has him going 26th to the Jacksonville Jaguars in his mock draft.
Balmer believes his draft stock wouldn't have soared to such heights if Blake hadn't become a part of his life. "Without him, I probably wouldn't be standing in front of you right now," Balmer said. |
http://nfldraft.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=778857 |
I thought we were looking for a good pass rusher. Balmer's record does not indicate that he is that player. |
Personally, I think that we need a pass rusher and a defensive tackle. Balmer might not have huge sack numbers, but with Marvin Austin starting next to him on the interior, I don't think that he was really asked to go after the qb a lot last season. He has started at defensive end for UNC so I think that he has the athleticism to be able to collapse the pocket and provide pressure up the middle. |
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SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Joined: 27 Dec 2005
Posts: 4884
Location: Surfside
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| Posted: Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:10 am Post subject: |
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| CanesSkins26 wrote: | | Branch wasn't selected in the first round. He was taken in the second round by the Cards. Comparing Moore to Branch is pretty interesting though. |
Whoops! You're right. He was the 1st pick in the 2nd round, 33rd overall. I wasn't really trying to compare them from the perspective of similarity. I believe Moore has greater potential and will be more productive. I was never impressed with Branch. If I had to guess, I'd say with good coaching and motivation, Moore could be the better player at the NFL level. But that's just a guess. |
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PulpExposure
Pushing Paper
Joined: 06 Sep 2005
Posts: 4461
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| Posted: Sun Mar 16, 2008 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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| yupchagee wrote: | | He recorded 6 sacks last yr. That led his team. That's very good for a DT. |
Of his 6 sacks, 4 came in 2 games. 2 against UVA (against a backup guard), and 2 came against Villanova.
Statistics can mislead you; he was a very inconsistent player at Maryland. Dominating Villanova and a young backup guard doesn't mean a whole lot to me.
NFL Draft Countdown gave him a mid-round rating (2 star):
| Quote: | Strengths:
Terrific size with a big frame...Excellent strength...Great speed and quickness with a burst to close...Plays with a nasty demeanor...Has good range and makes plays in pursuit...Can penetrate and wreak havoc in the backfield...Has the potential to be stout at the point of attack...Could play in multiple schemes...Has some upside.
Weaknesses:
Still pretty raw...Lackluster instincts and awareness...Inconsistent leverage...Does not use his hands well...Pass rush repertoire is limited...He doesn't play up to his weight room numbers..His work ethic and motor have been brought into question.
Notes:
First name is actually Marchondray...He played just one year of varsity football in high school..Could project to either a 4-3 or 3-4 scheme...Has everything you look for physically but just has not been able to put it all together yet, although he did have his best year as a senior...A "Workout Warrior" who will probably be chosen earlier than his film would otherwise indicate...Quite possibly a boom or bust type. |
ESPN ranked him a 69, which is about a 4th-5th round grade:
| Quote: | Strengths: Though needs to improve ability to shed blocks, plays with a bit of mean streak and has the upper body strength to improve in this area. Takes adequate angles to the ball, plays from snap until whistle and makes the occasional play in pursuit. Doesn't do a great job of anticipating the snap but is quick and can disrupt plays in the b backfield. Moves well laterally and could develop an effective arsenal of pass rush moves over time. Keeps head up and flashes the ability to sniff out screens. Played just one season of high school football and is still a little raw but has made strides and should only continue to get better with added experience.
Weaknesses: Plays too high, hasn't shown great lower body strength and can get driven back. Lacks elite size, plays with a narrow base and can't anchor against double teams. Takes too long to read keys when teams run at him and gets caught out of position at times. Doesn't use hands to protect legs, loses balance at times and struggles to fight off cut blocks. Frequently fails to get hands up when isn't going to the quarterback and doesn't always time jumps well.
Overall: Moore was redshirted in 2003. During his first three seasons (2004-'06) he appeared in 31 games (13 starts) and recorded 77 total tackles, nine tackles for loss, and 4.5 sacks. Moore's game isn't fundamentally sound and he has to work on anchoring against the run but there is a lot to like about his upside because he's got a great blend of quickness, athletic ability, range and size.
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No way you spend a 2nd rounder on a guy like him. If he was lazy in college (which is one long job audition), why the hell would he suddenly turn it on as a pro (when he's signed a contract for big money)?
He's got 2nd day draft pick written all over him. At the highest, I'd go late 3rd round with him, but I know some team will fall in love with his workout numbers and take him higher.
He's the classic trap d-lineman; got all the measureables, looks the part, but doesn't want to work hard or play hard all the time. That may get you through the ACC, but it's a different world in the NFL.
To me. he's Mario Monds from a bigger conference.
And remember, this is coming from a Maryland alum & fan. |
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SkinsFreak
Fire in the Sky
Joined: 27 Dec 2005
Posts: 4884
Location: Surfside
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| Posted: Sun Mar 16, 2008 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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I absolutely agree, Pulp. (Go Terps!  ) I only brought his name up cause he's listed on Mike Mayock's DE list. I wouldn't spend a 2nd on him either, and I don't think the Skins will. If he was still there on day two, then I'd think about grabbing him. But you're right, some team will probably pull the trigger on him on day one. When I googled his name, I saw him being discussed on several teams message boards. |
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