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Tuck28
newbie
Joined: 14 Dec 2009
Posts: 19
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| Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:46 pm Post subject: Matt Flynn |
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| I was reading the news on my phone, and I wish I would have paid more attention about who the author was but I didn't. Anyway he mentioned the fact that RGIII, who I really like, would probably go to Cleveland at 4 and the skins would draft a tackle from Iowa. Theen he mentioned that Matt Flynn would be a free agent this off season. My question to you guys is... What do ya'll think? |
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The Hogster
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Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 7002
Location: Washington D.C.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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The only way I'd be in favor of it is if we cannot land a QB in the draft that can be our Franchise guy. I think Kid Kyle needs a young guy who is essentially a blank slate who can grow into the role he wants. I personally don't think he has the chops to convert a veteran to his system. Just my opinion.
I am not sold on backups on offensive juggernaut teams like Green Bay. Kansas City gave up a king's ransom for Matt Cassell and he's not exactly the next Tom Brady. Same for Kevin Kolb.
As a result, I'd trade down if possible and pick the best player available on Offense with our Top 2 picks.
I think Brandon Weeden would be a Top 10-15 pick if he weren't 28 years old. But, being that he can probably play for another 7 years, I'd take him in a heartbeat especially if it meant that we could pick up another Offensive Tackle, WR, CB etc.
Ryan Tannenhill, Nick Foles etc will be there too. I'm not going to get too enamored of the "hot stock." I was a fan of Christian Ponder and Andy Dalton last year. |
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cowboykillerzRGiii
CKRGiii
Joined: 29 Jul 2010
Posts: 3162
Location: 505 New Mexico repn
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| Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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| I hear that but Flyn and Blackmon would be a nice way to boost the O right out the gates! |
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tribeofjudah
tribe
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 5996
Location: SURF CITY, HB, CALI *** Occasionally flying into a SUPERNOVA
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| Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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 ???
ahhhh....these speculation threads should not be on HogWash...???
There's already a Flynn thread on Around the League..... |
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1niksder
**********
Joined: 27 Mar 2004
Posts: 16578
Location: If I knew ... it would explain a lot but I've seen Homerville on a map, that wasn't helpful at all
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:05 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | How much money did Matt Flynn make with his play against the Lions?
Hard to say, although Flynn's market value will be determined long after the glow of Sunday's win has worn off. And the mixed results on recent contracts given to quarterbacks with a small sample size, though larger than Flynn's – see Ryan Fitzpatrick, Kevin Kolb – will be discussed around NFL front offices. Both players were given guarantees in the $20 million range. But again, too soon to tell.
Could the Packers place the Franchise Tag on Flynn and trade him?
They could, but I doubt they will. The one-year tender offer amount of roughly $14.5 million – Aaron Rodgers is scheduled to make $8 million – would immediately become guaranteed were Flynn to sign it. In that event, the Packers would be on the hook for that amount pending a trade, giving Flynn enormous leverage with a trade and/or a new contract.
Further, the Packers have been in negotiations with tight end Jermichael Finley on a new contract, using a relatively low potential Tag number of $5.4 million on Finley as their leverage. They would certainly like to keep that option available.
Finally, the Tag is meant to "reward" players with intent to sign rather than use as a placeholder while trying to trade the player. The NFLPA is keeping a watchful eye on these scenarios.
My sense is the Packers will not use this tool to hold Flynn in place. But, as always, stay tuned.
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NFP
I didn't do the breakdown but everything adds up... Here what a Flynn deal might look like:
It’s a breakdown of the contracts looking at what Kolb and Fitzpatrick got in guaranteed money, the money earned in the first 3 years of the deal, and the option clauses and payments
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Kolb - 6 years, $65m
Fitzpatrick - 7 years, $62m
Kolb got $21.5m guaranteed ($10m signing bonus, and $11.5m in guaranteed base salaries in 2011 and 2012), will earn $38m in the first three years, and has a $7m option bonus due in March 2012 – the second year of the deal.
Ryan Fitzpatrick got $24m guaranteed ($10m signing bonus, $9m in guaranteed base salaries the first three years and a $5m protected option bonus), will earn $28m over the first 3 years of the deal, and has a $5m option bonus due in March 2012 – the second year of the contract.
So a six year deal worth around $60m is a good place to start.
Term : 6 years
Total Contract value: $60m
Total guaranteed money: $16m
Signing bonus : $10m
Option Bonus (2014): $12m
Total Base salaries : $34m ($6m guaranteed)
Roster bonuses : $4m
Cap Hits per year:
2012 : $4.5m
2013 : $6.5m
2014 : $11.0m
2015 : $12.5m
2016 : $13.5m
2017 : $12.0m
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After two years the rookie is more than ready, they can let Flynn go or rework his deal.
Total cost = the first two years of salaries is part of the guaranteed money ($2.5m and $3.5m) + the signing bonus would be a cash payout of $16m or the total that was guaranteed, there would still be about $5/$6m in dead cap on the books in 2014. If the rookie is a bust Flynn would get his $12m bonus and the cap hit would be roughly the same as the dead cap would have been.
Cap hit in 2013 would be about $11.5m if Flynn flops |
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riggofan
Hog
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 2942
Location: Montclair, Virginia
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 9:18 am Post subject: |
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| The Hogster wrote: | | I am not sold on backups on offensive juggernaut teams like Green Bay. Kansas City gave up a king's ransom for Matt Cassell and he's not exactly the next Tom Brady. Same for Kevin Kolb. |
Its a gamble either way though isn't it? Yeah maybe you make a mistake and end up with Kevin Kolb. Or maybe you end up with Trent Green or Matt Schaub.
You can play the same game with drafting a 1st round QB. I'm not sold on drafting a QB in the first round because of Heath Schuler or Ryan Leaf or whoever.
Gotta hope the coaches do a good evaluation and make a good decision. |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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I don't know enough about Flynn to add anything intelligent to this thread (if I do most of the time anyway:), but what I do know is that they have to explore that possibility.
The skeptic in me (or the beat down Skins fan) tells me that if they sign this guy he will flop, RG3 will be there at 6 and we will trade down and get nobody of note for the trade down and RG3 will go on to have a HoF career. Or we sign Flynn, he flops, RG3 is gone, Blackmon is gone, and we can’t trade down. We sign a CB that doesn’t improve the D much.
I know I have been absolutely against taking Blackmon (or any WR in the top 16), but if we do go down the Flynn route we should at least get him a stout OL or an elite WR. So in that case, signing Fynn and then drafting Blackmon wouldn’t make me vomit. I would still kill the move, but at least I wouldn’t vomit!
But everyone here should know by now, whatever we do about QB it will be the wrong thing!!! I don’t care if we get RG3, trade up to get Luck, take a 2nd round QB or sign Flynn; they would all end up being Akili Smith, Ryan Leaf / David Carr, John Beck or Scott Mitchell. And the other three will be great players.
I know that is pessimistic, but it has been 75 years since we have drafted a franchise QB and 48 years since we acquired one via trade or FA. So I am conditioned to know that we will make a mistake at the QB spot, no matter what we do! |
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everydayAskinsday
Hog
Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 766
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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IF the Redskins sign Matt Flynn does anyone see them taking a QB in the 1st round still?
Lets say RGIII is sitting there at #6 for us... I think it would be a very TOUGH decision for the front office.. in signing Flynn you are essentially saying he is going to be your starter for the foreseeable future and now you have the option to address other holes on your team BUT a kid like RGIII might not come around again and Flynn might be a product of Green Bays system.. What would you do? One reason why its much easier being a fan |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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| everydayAskinsday wrote: | IF the Redskins sign Matt Flynn does anyone see them taking a QB in the 1st round still?
Lets say RGIII is sitting there at #6 for us... I think it would be a very TOUGH decision for the front office.. in signing Flynn you are essentially saying he is going to be your starter for the foreseeable future and now you have the option to address other holes on your team BUT a kid like RGIII might not come around again and Flynn might be a product of Green Bays system.. What would you do? One reason why its much easier being a fan |
being a fan of this team, I would take them both and then another one in the 4th or 5th round and HOPE that one of them would pan out, but knowing our history, all three would fail. |
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riggofan
Hog
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 2942
Location: Montclair, Virginia
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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| everydayAskinsday wrote: | IF the Redskins sign Matt Flynn does anyone see them taking a QB in the 1st round still?
Lets say RGIII is sitting there at #6 for us... I think it would be a very TOUGH decision for the front office.. in signing Flynn you are essentially saying he is going to be your starter for the foreseeable future and now you have the option to address other holes on your team BUT a kid like RGIII might not come around again and Flynn might be a product of Green Bays system.. What would you do? One reason why its much easier being a fan |
That's a good question. You'd kind of have to think if they brought in somebody like Flynn, they would probably look for a QB later in the draft. Its hard to imagine a scenario where they pay a lot for Flynn AND still use that #6 on RGIII.
Who knows though? The rookie wage scale has changed a lot. Maybe its more feasible to do something like that now? Clearly we need two good QBs, so its not like it would be crazy. |
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cowboykillerzRGiii
CKRGiii
Joined: 29 Jul 2010
Posts: 3162
Location: 505 New Mexico repn
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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I question how good Matt flynn would be in OUR system.. I think w the exp in gb under Rodgers he had a high chance to do well. Now couple that w great recievers to throw to and a pretty good line blocking he didn't really have much chance of NOT blowing it up. Add in the CBs trying to bait him being the back up and all he had to do was make a good choice. Detroit isn't exactly the best in the league against the pass either.
Now that's all speculation but lends itself to why I'm not sold on a guy that would- like any rookie drafted need to learn the system. For me I'd rather RGiii..
I think the FAs we really need to look at are at WR. I know Holmes wants out of NY.. DC? In dreamersville we sign RGiii and Blackmon and kill it for years... what if is fun but I expect any move to be an upgrade over rexy Becksy smh |
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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12767
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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| everydayAskinsday wrote: | IF the Redskins sign Matt Flynn does anyone see them taking a QB in the 1st round still?
Lets say RGIII is sitting there at #6 for us... I think it would be a very TOUGH decision for the front office.. in signing Flynn you are essentially saying he is going to be your starter for the foreseeable future and now you have the option to address other holes on your team BUT a kid like RGIII might not come around again and Flynn might be a product of Green Bays system.. What would you do? One reason why its much easier being a fan |
It's not that silly... RGIII is NOT NFL ready. He has fundamentals to learn. It is not likely that he will be game ready until deep into the season... if not the following season.
None the less, my thinking is that if the Shanahans deal with and get Flynn, they see him as their quarterback... and will look to do more foundation building on the offense... OL... and WR, and more finishing on the defense... DB's, NT, ILB... |
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1niksder
**********
Joined: 27 Mar 2004
Posts: 16578
Location: If I knew ... it would explain a lot but I've seen Homerville on a map, that wasn't helpful at all
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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| skinsfan#33 wrote: | | everydayAskinsday wrote: | IF the Redskins sign Matt Flynn does anyone see them taking a QB in the 1st round still?
Lets say RGIII is sitting there at #6 for us... I think it would be a very TOUGH decision for the front office.. in signing Flynn you are essentially saying he is going to be your starter for the foreseeable future and now you have the option to address other holes on your team BUT a kid like RGIII might not come around again and Flynn might be a product of Green Bays system.. What would you do? One reason why its much easier being a fan |
being a fan of this team, I would take them both and then another one in the 4th or 5th round and HOPE that one of them would pan out, but knowing our history, all three would fail. |
And I'd sign a UDFA, a second Vet FA (not named Rex). That would be sven QBs in camp.... Even with "the Danny" as owner our luck couldn't bethat bad |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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| riggofan wrote: | | everydayAskinsday wrote: | IF the Redskins sign Matt Flynn does anyone see them taking a QB in the 1st round still?
Lets say RGIII is sitting there at #6 for us... I think it would be a very TOUGH decision for the front office.. in signing Flynn you are essentially saying he is going to be your starter for the foreseeable future and now you have the option to address other holes on your team BUT a kid like RGIII might not come around again and Flynn might be a product of Green Bays system.. What would you do? One reason why its much easier being a fan |
That's a good question. You'd kind of have to think if they brought in somebody like Flynn, they would probably look for a QB later in the draft. Its hard to imagine a scenario where they pay a lot for Flynn AND still use that #6 on RGIII.
Who knows though? The rookie wage scale has changed a lot. Maybe its more feasible to do something like that now? Clearly we need two good QBs, so its not like it would be crazy. |
Someone on the radio (i wish i could rember who; Chris Russle, Scott Paulsen?) said that the offense run in GB is almost idneticle to the one we run. I have no idea if that is true or not, buit the person that said it knows way more about it than i do. |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Countertrey wrote: | | everydayAskinsday wrote: | IF the Redskins sign Matt Flynn does anyone see them taking a QB in the 1st round still?
Lets say RGIII is sitting there at #6 for us... I think it would be a very TOUGH decision for the front office.. in signing Flynn you are essentially saying he is going to be your starter for the foreseeable future and now you have the option to address other holes on your team BUT a kid like RGIII might not come around again and Flynn might be a product of Green Bays system.. What would you do? One reason why its much easier being a fan |
It's not that silly... RGIII is NOT NFL ready. He has fundamentals to learn. It is not likely that he will be game ready until deep into the season... if not the following season.
None the less, my thinking is that if the Shanahans deal with and get Flynn, they see him as their quarterback... and will look to do more foundation building on the offense... OL... and WR, and more finishing on the defense... DB's, NT, ILB... |
They said the same thing about Cam Newton, as a matter of fact most people think RGIII is more NFL ready than Cam was when he came out!
Whomever is drafted #6 will be expected to start before the first jacket is needed at FedEx. The #6 overall pick WILL NOT sit for very long and certaily won't sit for two seasons (or even one).
That is one of the reasons I think there is know way in hell Peyton is still a Colt in April if they intend on drafting Luck! Luck will start from day one for team team that drafts him. |
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