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Redskins_Fanatic
Hog
Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 1029
Location: Right On The Edge Of Goodbye
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:07 am Post subject: |
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| KazooSkinsFan wrote: | | Good point, it's not like we won a Super Bowl with Mark Rypien as our quarterback, did we? Which year was he enshrined in the HOF again? |
Two points...
1. This is not the NFL of 1991-1992. You will never again see a WR corps like The Posse, with guys like Terry Orr and Gerald Riggs and Ernest Byner all together on one team again. The Salary Crap does not allow for that.
2. As bad as he was, I would suggest we haven't had a QB nearly as good as Rypien in about 10 years. |
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CanesSkins26
Canes Skin
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 6870
Location: Alexandria, VA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 11:33 am Post subject: |
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| KazooSkinsFan wrote: | | Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | skinsfan#33 wrote: | What kind of dumb a$$ comment was that?
If you don't jane an OL or a QB then you could have HoF caliber players at WR and RB and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans.
If you improve the ol, your qb play improves, your running game improves and your WRs improve. And if you don't understand why I don't have the time to teach you! |
Okay, so what you're suggesting is that you, myself and four other THN posters should be able to win a Super Bowl as the skill position players if we were playing behind The Hogs? You have to realize the sheer lunacy of that idea, right?
I don't care if you give Rex Grossman 15 seconds back there, he is NOT going to make good decisions, and with a bunch of WR's and RB's who I have little to no confidence in, I'm pretty sure he will make the wrong decisions.
OL is important, but it's a very hollow thing if there are no skill players to take advantage of it. |
Good point, it's not like we won a Super Bowl with Mark Rypien as our quarterback, did we? Which year was he enshrined in the HOF again? |
We won with Rypien in the pre-free agency/salary cap era, when it was possible to stack a team full of talent in ways you cant now. Comparing our winning the Super Bowl with guys like Williams and Rypien to the realities of today's NFL is rather pointless because the NFL is so different now. |
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Jeremy81
Hog
Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 811
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | | Hes got all the skill guys worth picking gone by the sixth pick. Who would you take? With claiborne off the board...griffin gone...blackmon already drafted...and say you have nobody willing to trade down, what the hell is a better pick than that one? |
You're suggesting we don't have major and significant skill position needs on the DEFENSE too? It's not my preference but I'd be looking at CB's and Safeties or even possibly MLB in that case. |
Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
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Redskins_Fanatic
Hog
Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 1029
Location: Right On The Edge Of Goodbye
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Jeremy81 wrote: | Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Personally, in that situation, I stand up and walk out of the draft. There's nobody there I want at #6. Assuming I can't trade back, all I have to say is "PASS". I know that's not an opinion that is popular, but I'd take someone's second round pick just to get out of having to pick there at #6 if this comes to be. |
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Jeremy81
Hog
Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 811
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Personally, in that situation, I stand up and walk out of the draft. There's nobody there I want at #6. Assuming I can't trade back, all I have to say is "PASS". I know that's not an opinion that is popular, but I'd take someone's second round pick just to get out of having to pick there at #6 if this comes to be. |
What? And you really want to be taken seriously on this board?
Last edited by Jeremy81 on Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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1niksder
**********
Joined: 27 Mar 2004
Posts: 16578
Location: If I knew ... it would explain a lot but I've seen Homerville on a map, that wasn't helpful at all
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Personally, in that situation, I stand up and walk out of the draft. There's nobody there I want at #6. Assuming I can't trade back, all I have to say is "PASS". I know that's not an opinion that is popular, but I'd take someone's second round pick just to get out of having to pick there at #6 if this comes to be. |
That would be akin to trading down and getting no compensation for dropping in the draft order... in other words... That' is just stupid and would more than likely cost any current GM to be looking for work by the end of April. |
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riggofan
Hog
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 2949
Location: Montclair, Virginia
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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| 1niksder wrote: | | Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Personally, in that situation, I stand up and walk out of the draft. There's nobody there I want at #6. Assuming I can't trade back, all I have to say is "PASS". I know that's not an opinion that is popular, but I'd take someone's second round pick just to get out of having to pick there at #6 if this comes to be. |
That would be akin to trading down and getting no compensation for dropping in the draft order... in other words... That' is just stupid and would more than likely cost any current GM to be looking for work by the end of April. |
There is also just NO REASON to do this. People are still talking about the draft like its 2008. There is a rookie salary cap in place now. The #6 pick isn't going to break the bank, and there is little risk of overpaying him unless the guy just completely sucks. The #6 pick in 2010 negotiated a contract of $50m. The #6 pick after the CBA got $16 million.
Aside from just being a stupid opinion its completely ill informed. |
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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12771
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Jeremy81 wrote: | | Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Personally, in that situation, I stand up and walk out of the draft. There's nobody there I want at #6. Assuming I can't trade back, all I have to say is "PASS". I know that's not an opinion that is popular, but I'd take someone's second round pick just to get out of having to pick there at #6 if this comes to be. |
What? And you really want to be taken seriously on this board? |
You already know the answer to this... |
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CanesSkins26
Canes Skin
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 6870
Location: Alexandria, VA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Jeremy81 wrote: | | Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | | Hes got all the skill guys worth picking gone by the sixth pick. Who would you take? With claiborne off the board...griffin gone...blackmon already drafted...and say you have nobody willing to trade down, what the hell is a better pick than that one? |
You're suggesting we don't have major and significant skill position needs on the DEFENSE too? It's not my preference but I'd be looking at CB's and Safeties or even possibly MLB in that case. |
Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Luke Kuechly, MLB from BC, is a top 10 talent. Vontaze Burfict is probably outside of the top 10 right now, but could move up on draft boards depending on the combine and individual workouts.
Corner it's too soon to say, as much will depend on the combine. However, this draft is deep with top tier talent at the CB position...Claiborne, Kirkpatrick, Jenkins, Dennard, Hayward, Minnifield. |
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Redskins_Fanatic
Hog
Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 1029
Location: Right On The Edge Of Goodbye
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 2:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Jeremy81 wrote: | | What? And you really want to be taken seriously on this board? |
Honestly, the only position I have any interest in any team I'm rooting for DRAFTING is a Franchise QB. Other than that, I prefer Free Agents over draft picks 100% of the time. The only reason for the QB's is because you cannot get a Franchise QB in Free Agency. If that were possible, I'd have no use for the draft at all. |
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Redskins_Fanatic
Hog
Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 1029
Location: Right On The Edge Of Goodbye
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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| 1niksder wrote: | | That would be akin to trading down and getting no compensation for dropping in the draft order... in other words... That' is just stupid and would more than likely cost any current GM to be looking for work by the end of April. |
Remember that I have essentially no use for Draft Picks or Rookies at all, given an option. I have NEVER been a proponent of the Draft as the way to build a team. I'm certain that's been made very clear over time. Franchise QB is the ONLY position I have an interest in through the draft and that's only because they're not available in the FA market. |
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Jeremy81
Hog
Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 811
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:03 pm Post subject: |
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| CanesSkins26 wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | | Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | | Hes got all the skill guys worth picking gone by the sixth pick. Who would you take? With claiborne off the board...griffin gone...blackmon already drafted...and say you have nobody willing to trade down, what the hell is a better pick than that one? |
You're suggesting we don't have major and significant skill position needs on the DEFENSE too? It's not my preference but I'd be looking at CB's and Safeties or even possibly MLB in that case. |
Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Luke Kuechly, MLB from BC, is a top 10 talent. Vontaze Burfict is probably outside of the top 10 right now, but could move up on draft boards depending on the combine and individual workouts.
Corner it's too soon to say, as much will depend on the combine. However, this draft is deep with top tier talent at the CB position...Claiborne, Kirkpatrick, Jenkins, Dennard, Hayward, Minnifield. |
well, you're pretty matter of fact, but i don't agree. I think Kuechly is a top 20 talent, but not top ten. If there's a way to trade down, then there are a lot of options. However, in this scenerio, there are no trades. Reily Reiff is the best pick at number 6. Burfict is a late first rounder at best IMO and claiborne is gone already. no trade downs...you prefer jonoris jenkins at number six? you're picking chase minnifield with that pick? ok...If this draft is so deep with CB talent, why would you use a number 6 pick on one of those corners when chances are you can get one of those in the second? |
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CanesSkins26
Canes Skin
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 6870
Location: Alexandria, VA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Jeremy81 wrote: | | CanesSkins26 wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | | Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | Jeremy81 wrote: | | Hes got all the skill guys worth picking gone by the sixth pick. Who would you take? With claiborne off the board...griffin gone...blackmon already drafted...and say you have nobody willing to trade down, what the hell is a better pick than that one? |
You're suggesting we don't have major and significant skill position needs on the DEFENSE too? It's not my preference but I'd be looking at CB's and Safeties or even possibly MLB in that case. |
Ok, you throw out positions we should draft, and thats all good and great...but who? How about names mr. GM....claiborne is gone, so give me a cb worth the 6th pick in the draft. A safety? Who? Is there another sean taylor walking through those doors worthy of a sixth pick? Give me a name of a middle linebacker thats top ten talent
Youre the GM when you do a mock draft...so of those first five are gone, who are you picking? Instead of completely bashing someone elses opinion, tell me who'd you pick? Names, not positions. |
Luke Kuechly, MLB from BC, is a top 10 talent. Vontaze Burfict is probably outside of the top 10 right now, but could move up on draft boards depending on the combine and individual workouts.
Corner it's too soon to say, as much will depend on the combine. However, this draft is deep with top tier talent at the CB position...Claiborne, Kirkpatrick, Jenkins, Dennard, Hayward, Minnifield. |
well, you're pretty matter of fact, but i don't agree. I think Kuechly is a top 20 talent, but not top ten. If there's a way to trade down, then there are a lot of options. However, in this scenerio, there are no trades. Reily Reiff is the best pick at number 6. Burfict is a late first rounder at best IMO and claiborne is gone already. no trade downs...you prefer jonoris jenkins at number six? you're picking chase minnifield with that pick? ok...If this draft is so deep with CB talent, why would you use a number 6 pick on one of those corners when chances are you can get one of those in the second? |
I disagree with your assessment of Kuechly. The guy is a monster. I wouldn't be upset with him at #6, and I would certainly prefer him to a guy like Reif.
The point with the corners is that there is a lot of really talented guys in this draft, and depending on workouts, the combine, etc., one of the other corners could easily jump into the top 10. For example, McShay has Jenkins going 14 and Kirkpatrick going 17 right now. Either one has a killer combine and could easily shoot up into the top 10. With corners, where teams take measurables so seriously, some of these guys could really improve (or hurt) their draft stock. |
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Jeremy81
Hog
Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 811
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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Let me first say I do like Luke Keuchly. I think he's a good player. not top ten however. If there's a trade down scenerio, i wouldn't be disapointed with him in burgundy and gold...
well you seem to respect Mcshay's expertise. he's got Kuechly going 12 to kansis city and Reiff going 3rd overall to Minnesota. When you look at team need and best player available, i think Reiff is the right choice here. I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| GoSkins wrote: | | skinsfan#33 wrote: | | Redskins_Fanatic wrote: | | skinsfan#33 wrote: | | We have too many needs on the OL not t take an elite player there of a QB isn't available and we can't select a 2nd round QB at #6 just because we need one. |
Yep. Let's make sure old Sexy Rexy can stand back there in a nice, clean pocket and throw that wounded duck right between the letters of the Safety or Linebacker because none of his WR's can get open. Sounds like a great plan. Unless your intent is to allow for Rex, or whomever, to be in good shape for the fans to lynch after the game |
What kind of dumb a$$ comment was that?
If you don't jane an OL or a QB then you could have HoF caliber players at WR and RB and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans.
If you improve the ol, your qb play improves, your running game improves and your WRs improve. And if you don't understand why I don't have the time to teach you! |
Look at the OL of both the Giants and New England. Neither one is great. Are they good? Yes, but what separates the Giants from everybody else is an exceptional QB with great WRs. And New England has an equally stellar QB with WRs that did not have their best game and/or were hurt. |
I disagree. The Giants OL is better than their WR corps and of you don't agree with that fine, but saying NE WR are steller is just ridiculous. Welker is very good but he isn't a PB WR on any other team. The rest of their WRs are just guys. Gronkowski is a beast. But their OL is top shelf. That TD pass to Woodcock in the SB, Brady could have read War and Peace! |
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