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1niksder
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Joined: 27 Mar 2004
Posts: 16578
Location: If I knew ... it would explain a lot but I've seen Homerville on a map, that wasn't helpful at all
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 1:26 am Post subject: Trent Williams & Kory Lichtensteiger Better Than You Thi |
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Trent Williams & Kory Lichtensteiger Better Than You Think?
| Quote: | Kory Lichtensteiger only played five games last year, but in week two against the Cardinals, Kory managed the fourth highest graded game of any left guard in 2011. Here's what Pro Football Focus had to say:
| Quote: | | Going head-to-head with a talent like Calais Campbell often isn’t easy. Here, Lichtensteiger gave up just one pressure to the $55 million man while picking up three positive blocks in the run game against Campbell. Throw in some good work in the screen game, and this is exactly the kind of performance Shanahan wants from his interior linemen. |
This earned him a +4.5 grade for the game, only 0.3 of a grade off second place.
Then we had Trent Williams week 12 performance against Seattle. He was graded with the fourth best single game performance by any left tackle in the league in this game with a +5.2 rating. Here's their analysis on Trent's performance.
| Quote: | | Williams didn’t give up a single pressure or penalty, while grading positively five times in the run game. It was a near-flawless display and with Chris Clemons going up against you, that’s not often heard. |
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| Quote: | | Interesting then that despite all the injuries and suspensions, two of our offensive lineman still managed to put up some of the best performances of the year. Lets hope these two are back and can consistently put together these kind of performances, for Robert Griffin III's sake. Does this make you feel any more comfortable with our offensive line? |
Are we better off than we think?
I think so....
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UK Skins Fan
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Joined: 02 Mar 2005
Posts: 4437
Location: Somewhere, out there.
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 9:31 am Post subject: |
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My feedback is this:
DEPTH!
I think the Redskins starting group IS better than it's given credit for. But the depth behind that starting group is what was exposed last year. We need LeRibeus and/or Gettis to provide help inside, and an improvement at tackle too. Losing Locklear doesn't hurt us at all, but I'd like to see better than we had on the bench last year. |
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Red_One43
Hog
Joined: 16 Aug 2008
Posts: 4606
Location: D.C.
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| UK Skins Fan wrote: | My feedback is this:
DEPTH!
I think the Redskins starting group IS better than it's given credit for. But the depth behind that starting group is what was exposed last year. We need LeRibeus and/or Gettis to provide help inside, and an improvement at tackle too. Losing Locklear doesn't hurt us at all, but I'd like to see better than we had on the bench last year. |
That's was Shanny said!
| Quote: | Shanahan said that adding depth to the offensive line was a major priority with Kory Lichtensteiger fighting back from a season-ending knee injury.
“You never have enough depth in the offensive line,” Shanahan said. “That’s why I think it was big for us to get three offensive linemen that we were hoping we were going to get before the draft started. And we weren’t really sure when they were going to go, but we were counting on signing three after the injuries last year.
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http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/apr/28/redskins-kirk-cousins-robert-griffin-iii-nfl-draft/ |
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Chris Luva Luva
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Joined: 28 Jul 2003
Posts: 17801
Location: AJT
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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| People don't wanna hear stuff like this, they'd rather be uninformed and complain. |
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riggofan
Hog
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 2942
Location: Montclair, Virginia
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Read this the other day, good stuff. Not sure what it says about Lichtensteiger though coming off the injury. We'll kind of have to wait and see on that one. |
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mastdark81
Hog
Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 371
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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| We are better than what we think but NOT good enough to match up with COLE,BABIN,JENKINS, WARE, RATLIFF, OSI, PIERREPAUL, TUCK...twice a season. Until we can match up against the lines fairly then we will always be at the bottom. Outside of Trent Williams we dont have any one thats in the top 15 at their position on the oline...we have seen the games...those stats dont say nothing to me BC we were ineffective running the ball in those games Kory played |
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the poster
Hog
Joined: 02 Mar 2012
Posts: 389
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:26 pm Post subject: Re: Trent Williams & Kory Lichtensteiger Better Than You |
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um..no. it's one of the worst offensive lines in the sport. there's more than 2 players on an offensive line, the 3 other spots are garbage. and those 2 "bright spots" are just one joint and one blow to the knee away from their careers being in jeopardy.
I don't even think pass blocking is their problem. their ok at pass blocking, probably middle of the road. it's run blocking where this line is , at least to me, perhaps the worst line in the entire sport.
http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/40484/179/2012-offensive-line-rankings?pg=3 |
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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12768
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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| dftt |
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Chris Luva Luva
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Joined: 28 Jul 2003
Posts: 17801
Location: AJT
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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| mastdark81 wrote: | | We are better than what we think but NOT good enough to match up with COLE,BABIN,JENKINS, WARE, RATLIFF, OSI, PIERREPAUL, TUCK...twice a season. Until we can match up against the lines fairly then we will always be at the bottom. Outside of Trent Williams we dont have any one thats in the top 15 at their position on the oline...we have seen the games...those stats dont say nothing to me BC we were ineffective running the ball in those games Kory played |
Maybe they can match up against them if they had a competent QB behind them.
Did Indy's OL just all of a sudden go from top tier to worst in the league? No. There was a drop in QB talent. We've never dropped cus we haven't gotten high up enough. We'll see just how good/bad/promising our line is with RGIII. |
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FanofallthatisGibbs
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Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 214
Location: Somewhere in Central Asia
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 12:16 am Post subject: |
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This issue is not talent, not sure it ever has been a real talent issue over the years. It's consistency.
Be it injuries or otherwise, without consistency, one or two great games doesn't mean a damn thing in getting to the ultimate goal of lifting the Lombardi Trophy again. Consistency, consistency, consistency. Slow and steady and pound them into the ground until exhausted submission. That was the the mantra of the hogs of years past, and no reason to get away from it, even in a Zone Blocking Scheme. |
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FanofallthatisGibbs
Hog
Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 214
Location: Somewhere in Central Asia
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 12:18 am Post subject: |
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| Double post - ignore |
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UK Skins Fan
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Joined: 02 Mar 2005
Posts: 4437
Location: Somewhere, out there.
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 4:33 am Post subject: |
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| Chris Luva Luva wrote: | | People don't wanna hear stuff like this, they'd rather be uninformed and complain. |
As a general comment, I agree Chris. BUT, to be fair, this specific piece of analysis hardly substantiates any claim that our offensive line is close to elite, or even average. One off performances in single games don't really mean a lot in the context of a season. Consistency is what we need to see.
Of course, if anybody has access to some meaningful comparison of offensive lines for the whole season, then please share. I do think our line is better than it gets credit for, but that's probably another consequence of the team's poor overall record - until the team gains respect through wins, then every unit will continue to be undervalued by the "experts". |
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UK Skins Fan
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Joined: 02 Mar 2005
Posts: 4437
Location: Somewhere, out there.
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 5:09 am Post subject: |
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Not sure how meaningful this analysis is (I haven't had time to sit down and work out how it works yet), but it IS based on true statistical analysis of results for 2011, as opposed to simply being some words of opinion from somebody who watched some games.
http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol
What it appears to reveal is that our line was upper third in terms of run performance, and mid table for pass blocking. Given that they were trying to pass protecting two startled statues in Grossman and Beck, I would expect the presence of RGIII alone to help out with pass protection. |
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Chris Luva Luva
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Joined: 28 Jul 2003
Posts: 17801
Location: AJT
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 6:14 am Post subject: |
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| UK Skins Fan wrote: | | this specific piece of analysis hardly substantiates any claim that our offensive line is close to elite, or even average. One off performances in single games don't really mean a lot in the context of a season. |
You didn't have to read the article to know that this line is vastly improved over what it has been. This line played great before it was plagued with injury. In addition, after the rookies were inserted and reshuffled, they eventually gelled and played well the last couple of games.
| UK Skins Fan wrote: | | Consistency is what we need to see. |
More-so than consistency, I'd like to see less injuries, which would provide the cotinuity. But those injuries also benefitted us, our 2010 rookie got A LOT of playing time.
| UK Skins Fan wrote: | | Of course, if anybody has access to some meaningful comparison of offensive lines for the whole season, then please share. I do think our line is better than it gets credit for, but that's probably another consequence of the team's poor overall record - until the team gains respect through wins, then every unit will continue to be undervalued by the "experts". |
More-so than the W/L record, it's gonna be the QB play that elevates our OL ranking. Putting Curtis Painter behind the same line as Peyton Manning did what for Curtis? Nothing. Because it wasn't the offensive line, it was the QB.
Big Ben, he has a terrible offensive line, but his play elevates him.
GreenBay, really, how good is that offensive line? Is it Aaron or is it the line? Question for you. If you have the choice between Rodgers or his line, you'd pick Rodgers right? Of course you would.
If RGIII can be decisive in his throws and judicious with his runs, he's gonna make this line look really good. |
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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12768
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 7:26 am Post subject: |
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CLL said:
| Quote: | | If RGIII can be decisive in his throws and judicious with his runs, he's gonna make this line look really good. |
This... yeah... this. |
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