Impact of the Cap Case Dismissal

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Postby Countertrey » Tue May 29, 2012 2:32 pm

Topic, please! :wink:
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Postby gibbsfan » Tue May 29, 2012 3:55 pm

andyjens89 wrote::?

Hopefully this mess sorts itself out. Either way, I'm looking forward to better football from this team from here on out


+1 me too.
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Postby cowboykillerzRGiii » Tue May 29, 2012 5:05 pm

Deadskins wrote:
SkinsJock wrote:
Deadskins wrote:
SouthLondonRedskin wrote:WHAT WAS THAT!?!?!?!?

Sorry, I thought I heard something. Nevermind, carry on.....

It's not necessary to point it out every time the wind blows.


:shock: speaking of blowing wind - are you kidding? ROTFALMAO

pot meet kettle :lol:

Is that your opinion, or is that straight from the FO?

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Postby 1niksder » Tue May 29, 2012 6:07 pm

Countertrey wrote:Topic, please! :wink:


:twisted:

UK Skins Fan wrote:Not as bad as we might have feared?

..., but it does look as though the sky is NOT about to fall in. The work done by the front office (yes Jock, the front office!) to reduce dead cap money has been huge. The drafting of so many players in the last two drafts in particular has left us well placed (assuming that a decent number of this year's picks make the roster of course) We've been able to achieve as much as anybody in the offseason so far, and there are options available if we need to create more space.


They currently have about $4M in space with lots of changes coming based on who makes the team and who doesn't. The impact may have been harder on the front office this year than it will be next year considering they had less than 24 hours notice that they were losing $18M, but carried over $13M plus.

In the end they had $117.69M going in, they have 48 players signed to FA contracts, re-signed, drafted and signed (or will be signed) or signed as UDFA since they were stripped of the $18M., and up until this time next year to deal with next year's lower space.

Currently the 2013 is at $112,900,000 with no dead cap or carry over. If there is truly a flat cap then the Skin's number will be about what theHogster said $102.6M., meaning the Skins would be over by about $10.5M if this were Mid March 2013.

A lot will change by then...

There are 19 guys on that list that will take up more than $9M in cap space next year but none had played a down in the NFL nor did any team spend a draft pick on them. Most of them won't make the roster this season and the max in dead cap will be $18K or a reduction in the 2013 cap numbe by at least $8.5M.

Releasing Moss, Cooley and Hall will add $4.76M in dead cap for 2013 (almost twice the 2012 dead cap so far) but net $15.6M in cap space.

If replacement for Brown and Chester are on the roster going into the off season both could be released for a net savings of $900K so if they aren't playing the team won't be stuck with them.

Wilson, Williams, and Cofield would make good restructure candidates...

With the three cuts mentioned and the 19 players not likely to be on the roster next year the team is looking at being $9.6 under minus any new moves that would effect next year.

As of now they'll have three times the space they had this March :P

It's cap SPACE, so it's all in how you look at it :shock:
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Postby SkinsJock » Wed May 30, 2012 7:22 am

1niksder wrote:
UK Skins Fan wrote:Not as bad as we might have feared?

..., but it does look as though the sky is NOT about to fall in. The work done by the front office to reduce dead cap money has been huge. The drafting of so many players in the last two drafts in particular has left us well placed (assuming that a decent number of this year's picks make the roster of course) We've been able to achieve as much as anybody in the offseason so far, and there are options available if we need to create more space.


They currently have about $4M in space with lots of changes coming based on who makes the team and who doesn't. The impact may have been harder on the front office this year than it will be next year considering they had less than 24 hours notice that they were losing $18M, but carried over $13M plus.

In the end they had $117.69M going in, they have 48 players signed to FA contracts, re-signed, drafted and signed (or will be signed) or signed as UDFA since they were stripped of the $18M., and up until this time next year to deal with next year's lower space.

Currently the 2013 is at $112,900,000 with no dead cap or carry over. If there is truly a flat cap then the Skin's number will be about what theHogster said $102.6M., meaning the Skins would be over by about $10.5M if this were Mid March 2013.

A lot will change by then...

There are 19 guys on that list that will take up more than $9M in cap space next year but none had played a down in the NFL nor did any team spend a draft pick on them. Most of them won't make the roster this season and the max in dead cap will be $18K or a reduction in the 2013 cap numbe by at least $8.5M.

Releasing Moss, Cooley and Hall will add $4.76M in dead cap for 2013 (almost twice the 2012 dead cap so far) but net $15.6M in cap space.

If replacement for Brown and Chester are on the roster going into the off season both could be released for a net savings of $900K so if they aren't playing the team won't be stuck with them.

Wilson, Williams, and Cofield would make good restructure candidates...

With the three cuts mentioned and the 19 players not likely to be on the roster next year the team is looking at being $9.6 under minus any new moves that would effect next year.

As of now they'll have three times the space they had this March :P

It's cap SPACE, so it's all in how you look at it :shock:


thanks 1niksder and thanks UK :D

we can hope that we don't have to take that 18M hit again next year [-o<

can you imagine where we'd be if we still had dumb and dumber running things here - of course our record would have been a lot worse with Campbell as our QB and we could have drafted Luck without giving up any picks :puke:



thankfully we have a great FO that not only found a way to get RGIII, they also are digging us out of the mess we were in :P
one should always try to look on the bright side ... especially Redskins fans after the past 20 plus years

things will get better .... hopefully soon

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Postby 1niksder » Wed May 30, 2012 1:12 pm

SkinsJock wrote:thankfully we have a great FO that not only found a way to get RGIII, they also are digging us out of the mess we were in :P


The FO reworking contracts is what got them into this mess, if you discount Mara's jealousy and GoDaHell's urge to play God. In the end I call it a wash although the Redskins took a cap hit on Fat Albert last year but that dead money wasn't accounted for in the penalty.

But why not play with a few contracts now to undo the $18M they know they won't have next year?

The Redskins have about $3.5M in space now with a unused "Veterans Allowance" that won't have to be paid back until 2014, which makes the current space available to about $5M.

Restructure T. Williams now and save $5M+ in cap space for 2012 and another $2M next year by converting this years base and $4M of next year's to a signing bonus. This would increase this years space to over $10M with some of it likely to be carry over money. Williams base salaries are already guaranteed through 2013 so the team isn't taking any risk.

The same type of deals can be done with players like Cofield, Bowen, Chester, and Orakpo next year, but Williams has money due this year on his deal that won't be there next year.
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Postby andyjens89 » Wed May 30, 2012 1:22 pm

I have to ask - how do you know all of this? It's very intriguing. Are you an insider? 8)
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Postby Deadskins » Wed May 30, 2012 1:51 pm

andyjens89 wrote:Are you an insider?

No, he's a 1niksder. :lol:
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Postby Deadskins » Fri Jun 01, 2012 9:41 pm

Listening to this press conference with Shanahan, and several times he says he can't talk about the case right now, but he will when he can. When pressed about how the Skins and Pies have put out releases saying it's over, he still says he can't talk about it right now. It seems as though he saying the case is not really over for the Skins. Could be they're just waiting for the outcome of the NFLPA's suit, but I got the impression that the team is not quite finished fighting to get the money back. :wink:
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Postby 1niksder » Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:31 am

Deadskins wrote:Listening to this press conference with Shanahan, and several times he says he can't talk about the case right now, but he will when he can. When pressed about how the Skins and Pies have put out releases saying it's over, he still says he can't talk about it right now. It seems as though he saying the case is not really over for the Skins. Could be they're just waiting for the outcome of the NFLPA's suit, but I got the impression that the team is not quite finished fighting to get the money back. :wink:


:hmm: That's about Brian Banks getting a try out...

:idea: Did you mean the 7:50 mark of this press conference
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Postby Redskin in Canada » Sat Jun 02, 2012 3:37 am

I have not posted in this thread because I do not have insight be on what went on in the mind of the arbitrator (or evidence of outside influence).

I am NOT surprised about the outcome. I pretty much predicted this possible outcome BUT I expected a more elaborate and sophisticated ruling.

NOW the NFL has a collusion charge from the NFLPA. That is not going to be easy to handle politically as this ruling was. There will REAL legal and economic consequences.

The Skins and Pukes FOs now have to consider their options being in between a rock (ruling) and a hard place (the case brought against the NFL).

THAT is why Shanahan is not commenting YET. Not easy, folks. Not easy.

Give me a bit of time. :wink:
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Postby 1niksder » Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:54 am

Redskin in Canada wrote:I have not posted in this thread because I do not have insight be on what went on in the mind of the arbitrator (or evidence of outside influence).

I am NOT surprised about the outcome. I pretty much predicted this possible outcome BUT I expected a more elaborate and sophisticated ruling.

NOW the NFL has a collusion charge from the NFLPA. That is not going to be easy to handle politically as this ruling was. There will REAL legal and economic consequences.

The Skins and Pukes FOs now have to consider their options being in between a rock (ruling) and a hard place (the case brought against the NFL).

THAT is why Shanahan is not commenting YET. Not easy, folks. Not easy.

Give me a bit of time. :wink:


Check this out!

I found this interesting...

The Clubs have sought discovery in this proceeding, which the League has refused to provide

when combined with this...


Finally, the Clubs suggest that enforcement of the Reallocation Letter as ratified by the March 27 Resolution might (depending on facts as to which they seek discovery) condone violation of the 2006 CBA and perhaps the federal antitrust laws. But, as the League argues, the remedy for any breach of the 2006 CBA is to be found in that agreement, which is not a source of public policy for this purpose. Moreover, anticompetitive behavior in 2012 of the sort the Clubs imagine is similarly shielded from
antitrust inquiry, and any remedy must be found in the anti-collusion provisions of Article 17 of the CBA. The Clubs lack standing to enforce those provisions. See id., § 5.


Speaking of the 2006 CBA, a chance remains that the Cowboys and Redskins will next turn to the expired labor deal, since that’s the labor deal under which the disputed player contracts were negotiated and approved. That avenue has merit, and risk, because the appeal process eventually could land on the desk of Judge David Doty, who likely wouldn’t hesitate to call collusion if he sees it.

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Postby Deadskins » Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:32 pm

1niksder wrote:
Deadskins wrote:Listening to this press conference with Shanahan, and several times he says he can't talk about the case right now, but he will when he can. When pressed about how the Skins and Pies have put out releases saying it's over, he still says he can't talk about it right now. It seems as though he saying the case is not really over for the Skins. Could be they're just waiting for the outcome of the NFLPA's suit, but I got the impression that the team is not quite finished fighting to get the money back. :wink:


:hmm: That's about Brian Banks getting a try out...

:idea: Did you mean the 7:50 mark of this press conference

The link is to the Brian Banks article but the video it contains is of the entire press conference, of which the Brian Banks comment is just a small piece. Shanahan is asked about the cap theft twice. After the first time he says he can't speak about it right now, but he would address it when he was able to. Then, in a follow-up question later in the video, the reporter asks why he can't speak about it now, because the case appears to be over and the Skins have issued a statement. He repeats that he can't discuss it at this time, making it clear that there is still something going on with the case preventing him from commenting.
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Postby Redskin in Canada » Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:34 pm

1niksder wrote:[Check this out!

Interesting that this analysis COINCIDES with mine. I swear, I had not read it.

Rock and a hard place IT IS.

If the Mara groupd and Goodhale were smart and not proud and arrogant and stupid, they would settle in negotiations.

It is in nobody's self-interest among the owners to have done what they did.

The NFLPA though are paying for their stupidity to have come along with the penalties. Somebody gave them BAD LEGAL ADVICE.
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Postby Irn-Bru » Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:41 am

Redskin in Canada wrote:The NFLPA though are paying for their stupidity to have come along with the penalties. Somebody gave them BAD LEGAL ADVICE.


That, and they have incompetent leadership.
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