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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12770
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:56 am Post subject: |
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You have to have a defense in order to get to the playoffs.
Sam
Sonny.
Done.
Labaron get honorable mention.
Theisman is NOT in the conversation. He and Ryp, were the product of the mind of Gibbs. |
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StorminMormon86
Hog
Joined: 17 Oct 2011
Posts: 565
Location: Pasadena, MD
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 9:07 am Post subject: |
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Off the top of my head:
1. Sammy Baugh
2. Sonny Jurgensen
3. Joe Theismann
4. Mark Rypien
5. Billy Kilmer
6. Norm Snead
7. Doug Williams
8. Jay Schroeder
9. Mark Brunell
10. Brad Johnson
11. Robert Griffin III
12. Gus Frerotte
13. Eddie Lebaron
14. Todd Collins
15. Trent Green
16. Jason Campbell
17. Patrick Ramsey
18. Tony Banks
19. Kirk Cousins
20. Donovan McNabb
Griffin should NOT be in the top ten...not just yet anyway. There's no doubt he will be there eventually. |
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everydayAskinsday
Hog
Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 766
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:45 am Post subject: |
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| Countertrey wrote: | You have to have a defense in order to get to the playoffs.
Sam
Sonny.
Done.
Labaron get honorable mention.
Theisman is NOT in the conversation. He and Ryp, were the product of the mind of Gibbs. |
not to go off into a whole other debate but a great QB can overcome a poor defense.. look at the Patriots for instance, they have had Defenses routinely ranked in the bottom if not last in the league and they practically make the Super Bowl each year and are a playoff team because of Brady. The Redskins made the playoffs just this past year with a very suspect D but Great QB
but my point was that IMO I think playoffs/ Superbowls are important hence the reason I ranked Sonny lower than all you. |
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markshark84
Hog
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 1460
Location: Houston, TX
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:30 am Post subject: |
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Personally, I only think there are 5 (well 6) worth mentioning at this point:
1. Sammy Baugh
2. Joe Theismann
3. Sonny
4. Mark Rypien
5 (Tie). Kilmer & Williams
Personally, I give greater weight when a QB wins a SB. That's why #7 is above Sonny and #17 (as someone that only played 12 games as a skin) is even on the list.
I was tempted to put Mark Rypien above Sonny --- since he was the QB of arguably our greatest offensive season in history and had the best QB season in a SB year. However, Sonny was just too consistent and here for so long. It also doesn't hurt that he is still a huge part of the franchise even today as an announcer.
Kilmer was a solid QB, but not one of those "all time greats" that you talk about. Williams had an incredible SB run, but couldn't follow it up.
All in all, those are really the only skins QBs worth mentioning at this point (at least on an "all time" list). RGIII has the potential to top this list, but he needs to win a COUPLE SBs to do so. |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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Sammy - only QB to win multiple titles - next best athlete to RG3
Sonny
Joey T
Rypien
RG3
LeBaron
Kilmer
Brunel
Frerotte
Williams
Won't go any further, too sad! |
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The Hogster
#######
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 7002
Location: Washington D.C.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:26 am Post subject: |
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| StorminMormon86 wrote: | Off the top of my head:
1. Sammy Baugh
2. Sonny Jurgensen
3. Joe Theismann
4. Mark Rypien
5. Billy Kilmer
6. Norm Snead
7. Doug Williams
8. Jay Schroeder
9. Mark Brunell
10. Brad Johnson
11. Robert Griffin III
12. Gus Frerotte
13. Eddie Lebaron
14. Todd Collins
15. Trent Green
16. Jason Campbell
17. Patrick Ramsey
18. Tony Banks
19. Kirk Cousins
20. Donovan McNabb
Griffin should NOT be in the top ten...not just yet anyway. There's no doubt he will be there eventually. |
I understand your logic based on his experience level. But, Mark Brunnell? Jay Schroeder? Even with more experience, they had less than stellar careers with the Redskins. Unless you're going off of body of work. |
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langleyparkjoe
**LPJ**
Joined: 05 Oct 2007
Posts: 5993
Location: Langley Park, MD *Tick Tock*
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:55 am Post subject: |
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Gus will be the greatest Redskin QB EVER!!!.. He was so good that THN gave him his own Emoticon --->  |
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StorminMormon86
Hog
Joined: 17 Oct 2011
Posts: 565
Location: Pasadena, MD
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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| The Hogster wrote: | | I understand your logic based on his experience level. But, Mark Brunnell? Jay Schroeder? Even with more experience, they had less than stellar careers with the Redskins. Unless you're going off of body of work. |
Mark Brunell helped orchestrate one of the best comeback games in recent history...and it was against the cowpukes. He also led the team to a playoff victory, the last qb on this team to do so. Schroeder led the team back in 86 to a 12-4 record, then won the majority of the games for us next year which led us to a Superbowl victory. |
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The Hogster
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Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 7002
Location: Washington D.C.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Mark Brunell helped orchestrate one of the best comeback games in recent history...and it was against the cowpukes.
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This is true. I was a witness. But, keep in mind, in order to have a great comeback, you have to first be losing!  Don't get me wrong, that was a great comeback win. But, we were inept on offense for all 56 minutes of that game--much like we were all year.
| Quote: | He also led the team to a playoff victory, the last qb on this team to do so.
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A win is a win. But, to my last point, that win against Tampa Bay set an NFL record for futility. We were the only team in history to win a game with such a low total of yards. The Redskins only gained 120 total yards that game.  But, those were the days when Gregg Williams was dialing up Top 5 defenses year in and out.
| Quote: | | Schroeder led the team back in 86 to a 12-4 record, then won the majority of the games for us next year which led us to a Superbowl victory. |
I'll give you this one without much argument. This was a better year than RGIII had, but I simply gave RGIII a bump because I weighed their ability in addition to the stats. If it were a ranking of the best seasons by a QB, I'd go with this one over RGIII. But, when ranking the best QB, I'll put RGIII ahead of him. |
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StorminMormon86
Hog
Joined: 17 Oct 2011
Posts: 565
Location: Pasadena, MD
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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| I didn't want to put Griffin in the top ten just yet, but from what he's shown this year it will only be a matter of time before he is. |
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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12770
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| everydayAskinsday wrote: | | Countertrey wrote: | You have to have a defense in order to get to the playoffs.
Sam
Sonny.
Done.
Labaron get honorable mention.
Theisman is NOT in the conversation. He and Ryp, were the product of the mind of Gibbs. |
not to go off into a whole other debate but a great QB can overcome a poor defense.. look at the Patriots for instance, they have had Defenses routinely ranked in the bottom if not last in the league and they practically make the Super Bowl each year and are a playoff team because of Brady. The Redskins made the playoffs just this past year with a very suspect D but Great QB
but my point was that IMO I think playoffs/ Superbowls are important hence the reason I ranked Sonny lower than all you. |
Your argument that the Patriots have a poor Defense is factually wrong. They are flexible, and are superior on a short field. Beyond that, the Patriots frequently grind out yardage... that means, time on the field for the offense... every minute the O is ON the field, the D is NOT. They make the superbowl because they have an excellent Offense that controls the clock, and a Defense that is good enough. In the 60's, the Redskins defense consisted of 4 players. An average defense would have resulted in multiple post season performances.
When you have a quarterback like Sonny (and no running back, which was the case for MOST of Sonny's career)... you will score quickly quite often. That means that you may be losing the TOP war... and, if that's the case, your D had better be pretty darned stout.
Your characterization of this year's Redskins D is also based on a purely statistical analysis... This defense was quite good on a short field... and, like the Patriot's d... played pretty darned well in the second half of the season, and with it's back against the wall. |
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Deadskins
JSPB22
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 14722
Location: Location, LOCATION!
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Y'all got Joey T. too high on your lists. He's not top three. Those slots belong to Sammy, Sonny, and RGIII, not necessarily in that order. |
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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12770
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Deadskins wrote: | | Y'all got Joey T. too high on your lists. He's not top three. Those slots belong to Sammy, Sonny, and RGIII, not necessarily in that order. |
Not me... I have only Sam and Christian. No RG3... yet. If productivity remains the same next year, after teams have a chance to study film, then I will START to reconsider. |
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The Hogster
#######
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 7002
Location: Washington D.C.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| StorminMormon86 wrote: | | I didn't want to put Griffin in the top ten just yet, but from what he's shown this year it will only be a matter of time before he is. |
Agreed. |
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Countertrey
the 'mudge
Joined: 09 Jan 2004
Posts: 12770
Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| The Hogster wrote: | | StorminMormon86 wrote: | | I didn't want to put Griffin in the top ten just yet, but from what he's shown this year it will only be a matter of time before he is. |
Agreed. |
Ditto. |
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