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The Hogster
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Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 7002
Location: Washington D.C.
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| Posted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster, |
He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.
| Quote: | but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.
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No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely--got reinstated. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.
| Quote: | | Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team? |
Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.
| Quote: | Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.
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I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.
How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation.
Last edited by The Hogster on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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HTTRRG3ALMO
Hog
Joined: 01 Jan 2013
Posts: 500
Location: Washington, DC
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| Posted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| The Hogster wrote: | | Quote: | | I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster, |
He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.
| Quote: | but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.
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No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.
| Quote: | | Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team? |
Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.
| Quote: | Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.
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I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.
How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation. |
Great points about signing FA talents. Hard not to get sucked into that mentality of signing "better" players from other teams.
Not sure what the coaches have been doing but they're rock solid on player development. Some players obviously respond better than others.
I think the real mystery is Shanny's mind; how he can spot that "fit" everyone else seems to overlook. Gotta love it!! |
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riggofan
Hog
Joined: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 2949
Location: Montclair, Virginia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/49962/eight-in-the-box-free-agency-winnerslosers
| Quote: | | Washington Redskins: Loser. They've actually done well to hold together as much of their division-champion team as they have, considering the $18 million in cap penalties they're still dealing with this year. But they had to cut cornerback DeAngelo Hall, lost special-teams captain Lorenzo Alexander, and have yet to re-sign tight end Fred Davis. More importantly, though, they still have major needs in the secondary and have been unable to land the free safety or the starting cornerback they need. E.J. Biggers is probably better as a No. 3 cornerback, though at this point he may project as one of their starters. The good thing is that the safety and cornerback market still has lots of options, and the prices aren't going up. But the Redskins have no first-round pick next month, so they have some challenges ahead. |
Yeah I'm a homer, but I couldn't disagree with this more. Given the cap penalty, I've been really happy that we've been able to retain as many of our own free agents as possible. Keeping your division champion team largely intact under those conditions sounds like a win to me.
I know in these things winning/losing free agency is pretty much about who was able to land the most big names. Don't these writers remember when we "won" Albert Haynesworth? How about when the Eagles beat everybody in FA to assemble the vaunted "dream team"? lol. |
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yupchagee
#14
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 4112
Location: Louisville KY
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| Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:37 am Post subject: |
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| The Hogster wrote: | | Quote: | | I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster, |
He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.
| Quote: | but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.
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No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely--got reinstated. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.
| Quote: | | Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team? |
Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.
| Quote: | Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.
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I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.
How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation. |
I think his suspension will be lifted as soon as we release him. |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:13 am Post subject: |
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| The Hogster wrote: | | Quote: | | I don't think Tenard Jackson is technically on the roster, |
He is on the roster. The team, knowing his situation, opted to keep him.
| Quote: | but even if he is he is still suspended for life from the NFL.
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No he isn't. His suspension was "indefinite" because he had been in the NFL Substance Abuse program and had offended multiple times. An indefinite suspension is not "for life." It means that he has to comply with rules before being reinstated. Even Michael Vick--who served 2 years in Federal prison, and was suspended indefinitely--got reinstated. What makes you think Jackson will not be? I'd be curious if you have any precedent you're basing this on or if you're just being pessimistic.
| Quote: | | Now most assume he will be reinstated a few days before the season starts, but what if that doesn't happen. Or he fails yet another drug test (definitely probable). He is most likely and upgrade over Madoodoo. I'll agree with that, but will he be on the team? |
Most assume that because that's what generally happens. I can't recall a player who smoked himself out of the NFL and garnered a ban for life. Some guys have been in the program and just weren't worth bringing in. But, Jackson is talented. Shanahan likes him enough to have kept his rights through this suspension, and we are in need of someone with talent that plays his position. He fills a need, is talented and is cheap.
| Quote: | Dreading a CB in the 2nd or third round and expecting him to be an upgrade next year over DHall is bad odds. Vegas would side on that not working out and take every dollar they could get because the odds are it is easy money for them. Smoot at his best wasn't as good as DHalll was last year and he was a good draft pick. Yes. We could get a BC in those rounds that is an improvement over Hall, but the odds aren't very good.
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I don't agree with your philosophy here. D Hall is a veteran playmaker who made the Pro Bowl. But, I don't recall winning any Superbowls with him, or any other team for that matter. We don't need a guy to be better than him in order to be an upgrade. If a young player can come in and play well within the system, and this secondary--with the return of Jackson and Merriweather, and an improved PASS RUSH with Carriker and Orakpo back, then the team can still improve.
How many years did we bring in talented guys who didn't play well, or play hard, or gel within the system? That's not how you build a winning team. We don't need to sign Namdi, Charles Woodson etc just to improve the secondary. We were the 30th ranked secondary last year WITH DHall. There's room for improvement, even if a rookie is in the rotation. |
I know that TJ was on the "reserve - suspended" list. What I was unsure of (and do are you) is if that is technically part of the roster. It certainly isn't part of the 53 man roster or the off-season 80 (or however many it is) man roster. So it seems like he isn't on our roster right now. He is on a reserve list.
I must bee older than you (45) because these indefinite drug suspensions used to be called life time suspensions. It was exactly the same suspension when Dexter Manley got suspended for "life" then ended up playing for the Cardinals a year or two later.
So we are talking about the same punishment. Kind of like arguing whether the name of a small horse like animal is a donkey or an ass. Two different names for the same animal, just one seams a bit more harsh.
I agree that a player drafted next year might be better for the team down the road that Hall, but that wasn't what I was arguing. I'm on my phone so I'm not going to cut an paste where this all started but basically I was saying that getting better at RT, S, and CB next year true the draft is extremely unlikely. You would have to agree that if we improved at two of those three spots over what we had last year via the draft then Shanny pulled a minor miracle. I'm not talking down the road improvement or over all team play, I'm talking improvement next year at those spots. |
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SkinsJock
08 Champ
Joined: 24 Feb 2004
Posts: 11521
Location: New England
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| Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:52 am Post subject: |
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^^^ ... THEN
IF we added a CB and a Safety thru the draft and found another RT to go with the 6 or 7 already thinking they have a shot
you'd have to say that the guys in charge 'IMPROVED' the team and have pulled of a 'minor miracle' ..  |
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Deadskins
JSPB22
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 14722
Location: Location, LOCATION!
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| Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:20 am Post subject: |
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| For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anythg that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh |
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SkinsJock
08 Champ
Joined: 24 Feb 2004
Posts: 11521
Location: New England
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| Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Deadskins wrote: | | For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anything that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh |
for a moment there ... I took it that you must be referring to skinsfan#33 ...
then I realized that you, mostly, don't read all the posts and took my "you'd have to say ..." as being my thoughts ...
when obviously, I was referring to skinsfan#33's post that anything like that happening would be a 'minor miracle' 
no worries - I like helping you out  |
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Deadskins
JSPB22
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 14722
Location: Location, LOCATION!
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| Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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| SkinsJock wrote: | | Deadskins wrote: | | For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anything that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh |
for a moment there ... I took it that you must be referring to skinsfan#33 ...
then I realized that you, mostly, don't read all the posts and took my "you'd have to say ..." as being my thoughts ...
when obviously, I was referring to skinsfan#33's post that anything like that happening would be a 'minor miracle'
no worries - I like helping you out |
No, I generally just glance over your posts, figuring I've already read what you have to say a hundred times before.
I was talking to sf33. You're no optimist. |
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SkinsJock
08 Champ
Joined: 24 Feb 2004
Posts: 11521
Location: New England
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| Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Deadskins wrote: |
No, I generally just glance over your posts, figuring I've already read what you have to say a hundred times before.
I was talking to sf33. You're no optimist. |
WHEW - well that's a relief - I'm glad you haven't lost all your marbles .. yet |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:36 am Post subject: |
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| Deadskins wrote: | | For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anythg that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh |
Never claimed to be an optimist; I'm a realist. |
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skinsfan#33
#33
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 3875
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| Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:43 am Post subject: |
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| SkinsJock wrote: | ^^^ ... THEN
IF we added a CB and a Safety thru the draft and found another RT to go with the 6 or 7 already thinking they have a shot
you'd have to say that the guys in charge 'IMPROVED' the team and have pulled of a 'minor miracle' .. |
It would depend on how they play. If their play an improvement over Hall's, Polumbus', and even Madoodoo's play. Then yes I think it would be minor miracle.
And since you want to take this too literal, by saying it would be a minor miracle, what I am saying is it is a extreme long shot that that will happen.
If you don't get what I'm saying or disagree, I'm fine with that but I'm done trying to explain something that is so basic. |
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SkinsJock
08 Champ
Joined: 24 Feb 2004
Posts: 11521
Location: New England
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| Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:41 am Post subject: |
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^^ you're right I am being a little picky about this .. BECAUSE ...
adding a RT, a safety and a CB or 2 just flat out makes this team better ...
I think we add a RT - with that plus the competition to be the starter - I don't see how the O line is not improved from what we had
with the return of injured players plus a draft with a lot of good secondary players - we should see better play from the back 7 on D
with this FO's history the past few years, we can expect to see the team be 'better' in these areas
IMHO - that's not being optimistic that's being realistic - |
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Deadskins
JSPB22
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 14722
Location: Location, LOCATION!
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| Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| skinsfan#33 wrote: | | Deadskins wrote: | | For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anythg that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh |
Never claimed to be an optimist. |
Sorry, got you confused with skinsfan55. |
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SkinsJock
08 Champ
Joined: 24 Feb 2004
Posts: 11521
Location: New England
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| Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Deadskins wrote: | | skinsfan#33 wrote: | | Deadskins wrote: | | For an optimist, you sure do seem to think anythg that's under 50% probability is a miracle. smh |
Never claimed to be an optimist. |
Sorry, got you confused with skinsfan55. |
now that's funny .... well sort of |
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